Bordeaux Wine Enthusiasts

I was able to pick up a bottle of this today locally, thought I would give it a shot....

Pretty shy, reticent nose, but some crisp red fruits, and coffee scents are poking through. Nice richness on the palate, red fruits, tobacco, and some acidity and tannin clipping off the finish. A bit of St. Estephe character poking through, but this seems to be a bit modern in style. A really nice wine that should smooth out with a year or 2 and the palate will broaden. This is a good cellar defender for a Wednesday night. I'll be buying more @ $20.

Does this seem like a legitimate wine? I recall drinking about a case of the 2003 and I found it watery and thin, basically supermarket level. It has caused me to shy away ever since. I know Danny is a big fan but I wonder why, if it is so good, that a St. Estephe in this day and age is selling for under $20? To each his own, I guess.

Legitimate wine-yes!

Thin and watery? I can certainly see how "thin" could be a descriptor. The color is rich and dark, the palate does not get there. Watery? Not to me.

Pure St. Estephe character-no. More modern than you generally find in St. Estephe. Not complex, not a wine to make you search for depth.

Can you find better at +/- $30-35-yeah, that is fair to say.

For $20 midweek-sure. Something to open while others come together.

The 2000 was tannic and acidic (though fleshy) and took 15 years to come around. The 2003 was quite different, very open and enjoyable if a little short. Kind of a fruit ball vice a fruit bomb. Tasting these lesser chateau may be more important than the bigger/better ones.

I’ll have to try a bottle of the 2014.
I retasted the 2014 Lafon Rochet to see if I want to buy more in quantity.
That wine is the real deal, a real beauty. Lots of depth.

2009 LL very good with lots of life ahead. I think better than the 03 which was quite enjoyable as I`ve said. 14-16s haven`t arrived yet. New worldish but nice leather cedar St Estephe character for a whole lot less $$.than Lafon Rochet but similar styles. Don`t expect a big powerful wine but a pleasant weekday or backyard quaffer.

Of course I have very different drinking habits, I don't drink midweek quaffers. I drink only bottles that are generally 90+ points.

Jim, as Benevolent Dictator of BWE, doesn’t the simple act of you opening a bottle make it a 90+ point wine?

Review in Winemag:

Château Lilian Ladouys 2014 Saint-Estèphe
93
POINTS
Cellar Selection
0
Under the ownership of Jacky Lorenzetti, president of one of France's top rugby clubs, this estate is now performing impressively. The wine is finely structured with dark tannins and tight acidity and a hint of minerality. It is Merlot dominated, although it is the 40% Cabernet Sauvignon that brings out the black-currant fruitiness. Drink from 2022.

Jim

You're become a Bordeaux wine snob!! Does a wine have to be expensive to capture your attention or just good. Can't look at anything other than classified growths?? To me mid week quaffers all have to be above 90+ points because I don't have a bottle that I'm aware of in my cellar below 90pts apart from the odd chianti pizza wine possibly but they as well usually have to have that 90 pt yardstick to get downstairs. My definition of quaffer may be different than most because of what's in the cellar. If it's under $50-60 range its a quaffer. Realize the 2014 Lilian Ladouys on your side of the border is $20-25 and up here it has just come out as a January special release at $40!! Another reason to slow down on buying.

I've bought 9 bottles of the '14 so far, and I don't plan on opening one until 2020 at least. In the meantime I'll drink the last one of my '09s and the few '10s I have.

JimHow wrote:Of course I have very different drinking habits, I don't drink midweek quaffers. I drink only bottles that are generally 90+ points.

Where does one find wines rated less than 90 points nowadays? They are quite rare it seems.

Danny:

Two words:

Barde. Haut.

Hound, I think DavidG is right:
All wines consumed by the BD are 90+ wines.

AlohaArtakaHoundsong wrote:

JimHow wrote:Of course I have very different drinking habits, I don't drink midweek quaffers. I drink only bottles that are generally 90+ points.

Where does one find wines rated less than 90 points nowadays? They are quite rare it seems.

Only from regions Suckling has not been to yet.

lol

I found the '14 Barde Haut yesterday too, going to try to open it up this weekend...

looking forward to your notes danzur.
The only right banker I had from 2014 was that Tour St. Christophe, which was stellar.

Jim,

Barde Haut....say no more....now there was another bad WOTY decision. I'm happy I had the chance to see what the supposed hype was about last year in San Fran stuffed into Stefan and Lucie's hotel room enjoying a pre dinner tasting and a few laughs. You may recall my reaction to BH WOTY..... only a couple of years ago a certain someone was claiming that the right bank wasn't really part of Bordeaux then...WHAM!!...Barde Haut WOTY!!

I will help you BD: the 2012 Chateau Barde Haut is so concentrated that it is a merlot wine that magically taste like a .... cabernet sauvignon wine!

I had mixed experiençes with Lilian Ladouys, but i did not sample that many vintages. last vintage i had, the 2008, i feel it was too young and oaky.

Nic

Nic,

Black plums vs cassis...good try! Oak dominated the fruit anyhow. Maybe this suffered from bottle shock and I'll give the benefit of the doubt that this was not showing that well. Usually Jim has pretty good taste and I'll defer my conclusion but not rushing out to buy some like the Meyney that Danielle picked up from Hull today.

Problem for us locally with Lilian Ladouys and others are the stupid prices we have to pay now. I paid $28-29 for each case of 09/10/14-16 at futures. Now the 14 is being released for $40 at the LCBO through the Classics release is getting a little out of line when it can be had for $20-25 State side. I'm happy that I've loaded up along the way but now I'm feeling more than ever we're getting ripped off.

I enjoy cognac and my go to is Remi VSOP. 750ml LCBO $95 and Costco Palm Desert $32.99. Go figure!!!

Danny:

Robert Parker and I rated the 2012 Barde Haut at 94 points.

94 points. And I think I paid $28 per bottle.

Mmmm. 2012 Barde Haut....

94 points, per Robert M. Parker, the greatest wine palate in the history of the world.

Jim:

I love it. Now your you are a HWSRN fan. The once great judge of Bordeaux through the 80s then maybe early 90s. The one that developed a passion forover extracted oak laden wines and became more of a fan of Cali Cabs and big bold Aussie wines sending the Left bank Bordeaux Chateau realing. Turned his back on the left bank and found love on the right. Yep there must be some disease affecting lawyers from the northeastern USA. Starts with loss of sensitivity to oak then palate dulled to ripe fruit and can no longer taste the sublties of fine wine. Once it affects your hearing then its game over I`m told!!!

Danny: Robert Parker is an American lawyer who brought the intelligence and fairness of the American legal system — from a country that stands for freedom of thought and the striving for fairness and merit — to the tired, ancient European system of ranking French wines. His 100 point system is quintessentially American, piercing through centuries of preconception and “doing it the old way.” His system has caused all boats to rise in quality. Thus, the rise of stellar properties like Barde Haut, etc. God bless attorney Robert Parker, Esq. And may God bless America.

Jim,

I rest my case. Who can TRUMP that closing argument. Thank God for America and RMP coming to the savior of those pagaen Europeans in Bordeaux and across Europe to cast a light where once darkness reigned. Yes we are truly blessed and the world is truly thankful!!

On that one, I agree with Danny. Saying Mr. P the greatest wine palate in the World is like saying Pamela Anderson is the best beach rescuer!

Nic

Nic,

A little Canadian solidarity going into the holiday season.

Merry Christmas to You and the family.

Nic-she isn't?

Isn't Pamela Anderson Canadian?

I brought a bottle up here to Mammoth Mtn, so I can compare notes with others.

=========

When it comes to scores, I'm not drinking enough wines side by side anymore, at big panels, to really rank them and assign scores I would feel confident in.

If one tastes a wine and assigns a 94 pt, and then retastes it sometime later, assuming it still sound and has not changed/matured/declined, presumably a consistent taster should be able to slot it back into the 94 pt level, even blind.

I can't do that.

But in general I can identify bottles that are good, great, outstanding, excellent etc.*. And that's about the level of granularity I can get to. I'm living in a 680 ppi world when everyone else has moved on to high def cable! (I don't have cable either).

* I just use the US school grading system, A , B, C etc.

I pulled the cork on this.

2014 Lilian Ladouys [St Estephe] Medium bodied on the swirl. Oak and cassis on the nose. There's a bit of tannin here at first, but fits well with the texture, and its not raspy nor stemmy/green tannins. Creamy feel to the palate. For a young BDX, the fruit is a little wan. Perhaps that will blossom as the tannins polymerize out. I think this needs food to show better. It's a nice wine, I'll give it a few hours. Right now I'm not inclined to pick up more than the other bottle I already have. This does not have the fatness I seem to remember in the 2003.

The second glass has really richened up. Not too shabby!

Good notes....thanks....you're a better note writer than I....

Happy Holidays!