Bordeaux Wine Enthusiasts

Posted: **Sun Feb 12, 2023 5:23 pm**

Hey All,

My knowledge of the 2004 vintage is very, very limited. My nephew's birthday was 2004, and I am starting to look at grabbing a bottle to give to him for his birthday. I still have a couple of years, but I'm looking now and will store in my cellar until it's time.

Has anyone had any 2004 wines recently that they could recommend? I was thinking a chateau that may lean more modern vs traditional, but hoping to get some opinions here first.

Thanks for your help!

Posted: **Sun Feb 12, 2023 5:24 pm**

Smith Haut Lafitte jumps out at me.

Posted: **Sun Feb 12, 2023 5:43 pm**

Jim's suggestion is good. Also, Malescot St Exupery. If you decide instead to go traditional, Leoville Barton. Only SHL should exceed $100.

The great value play in 2004 was in Burgundy rather than Bordeaux, such as Chevillon NSG 1er. I also regret not buying more Drouhin Musigny. The many unsuccessful Burgs in 2004 seemed to depress the price of the good ones. In that respect 2004 was similar to 2007, I think.

Posted: **Sun Feb 12, 2023 5:54 pm**

Thanks Jim and stefan, for those suggestions. I forgot about Malescot. Did Poyferre, Pape Clement, or Pontet-Canet make a good wine in this vintage?

Posted: **Sun Feb 12, 2023 6:49 pm**

Or you can go with the poster child of the modernist movement in Gerard Perse’s Chateau Pavie. My guess is the vintage conditions saved it from being as flagrant as some of the surrounding vintages.

I do also like Jim’s SHL suggestion.

Posted: **Sun Feb 12, 2023 6:53 pm**

Thanks, jckba. I actually didn't even think about going right bank. Was 2004 better on the left or right bank? I may look more into that now.

Posted: **Sun Feb 12, 2023 7:02 pm**

I have a case of 2004 Pontet Canet but I haven't cracked it open yet. I'm not independently remembering trying it, unless we tasted it at the chateau in 2015. Was that one of Jean-Michel Comme's first vintages?
I think someone here recently had reservations about it, but then I'm thinking Nicola had a bottle and he liked it.
Or I could be completely misremembering all of that.

Posted: **Sun Feb 12, 2023 7:39 pm**

Well, I tried a 2004 Malescot in September 2019 and it was very disappointing. The Smith Haut Lafitte is a better bet.
I would try Poyferre before Barton and Pape Clement.
2004 Burgundies were very green upon release, they are much better now.
2004 Chiantis are fantastic.

Posted: **Sun Feb 12, 2023 7:44 pm**

Jim Jean-Michel Comme resigned in 2020 after 31 years at Pontet Canet…he didn’t seem overjoyed by Michel Rolland’s involvement when we visited.

I was not a big fan of their 2004 and it was one of the few wines I ended up selling, perhaps prematurely.

I think 2004 is a useful vintage. Leoville Barton is a stand out of course, and Lynch is very good too based on the one I tried a few years ago.

As Jim notes SHL…I liked Pape Clement too as it was a bit more dialled down than the 2001.

Outside Bordeaux 2004 is a good year in Barolo and not a bad one in the Northern Rhone.

Posted: **Sun Feb 12, 2023 8:14 pm**

Had the 04 Poyferre a couple of times (most recently in 2019) and whilst I enjoyed it, it was quite modern in style. Léoville Las Cases was the 04 that impressed me the most.

Posted: **Sun Feb 12, 2023 8:26 pm**

Both Pontet Canet and Barton will not disappoint with a slight edge to the Barton but both are excellent choices. Good luck hunting.

Posted: **Sun Feb 12, 2023 11:04 pm**

2004 is a kind of Jekyll and Hyde vintage imho.

From the start it was marked by big, unresolved and not always ripe tannins. Both from barrel and after bottling. Many chateau owners told me in following years that these tannins will eventually soften.

For some properties it happened and for others didn't.

I guess they harvested a bit too early unaware of phenolic ripeness necessity.

Posted: **Mon Feb 13, 2023 2:43 am**

The 2004 Ch Clerc Milon has always impressed me as an over achiever.

Posted: **Mon Feb 13, 2023 3:29 am**

In 2004, i surely recommend the montrose, Léoville Barton, but on top the Léoville Las Cases.

2 Pomerol that are very complex, drinking well and very classical are Trotanoy and l'Église-Clinet.

Finally, the 2004 Pavillon Rouge impressed us all, at the Château, in 2015.

Posted: **Mon Feb 13, 2023 4:59 am**

IMO 2004 is an excellent vintage that is very underrated. Has a lot of charm. Had a fantastic 2004 La Conseillante last week that was drinking great. 2004 Pichon Baron is another very good wine

Posted: **Mon Feb 13, 2023 2:50 pm**

If you're looking for more modern, then I would recommend the Leoville Poyferre. It's a very solid wine.

I also second Marcus's suggestion about the 2004 Pichon Baron, the bottle he opened for me last year was wonderful and in a great spot with beautiful minerality as it opened.

Posted: **Mon Feb 13, 2023 3:01 pm**

I quite like Léoville Barton.

AR

Posted: **Mon Feb 13, 2023 3:10 pm**

Thanks again or everybody's suggestions. I think I am leaning towards the Poyferre or SHL. B21 currently has the Poyferre for $129, which seems like a good price. I purchased from them before, but only for more current releases. This bottle is not an ex-chateau. Has anyone purchased older bottles from here before, and would you recommend a purchase like this?

Posted: **Mon Feb 13, 2023 4:25 pm**

https://www.farrvintners.com/blog/post.php?post=1180

Southwold on Thames tasting of the 2004 vintage, 10 years on. Maybe a bit dated now given it was 9 years ago. Not much in the way of personal experience to share re Bordeaux 04 unfortunately. Happy Hunting

Posted: **Mon Feb 13, 2023 5:14 pm**

One I forgot: Haut-Bailly also was (is) very good indeed in 2004

Posted: **Mon Feb 13, 2023 6:25 pm**

Thank you for the article, Dionysus...very good read! Now that has me rethinking a couple of others.

I researched the Haut-Bailly, and that seems pretty solid too. I am going to add Haut-Bailly and Pape Clement on the list with Poyferre and SHL (and possibly Pontet Canet). I think it is between these 5 chateaux.

Posted: **Tue Feb 14, 2023 3:06 am**

Not sure about the modern thing, I prefer more classic...but may want to go with Pavie, Barde Haut, Monbousquet or Château Pavie Decesse

Posted: **Tue Feb 14, 2023 10:22 am**

It was you I thought of when I suggested SHL, Bobby G, I’m surprised it’s not on your list.

Posted: **Tue Feb 14, 2023 1:33 pm**

Guys
2004 is hard to generalise.
I found most wines from this vintage to be rather angular and at times unbalanced.
My view is that St Julien performed well on the LB and Pomerols on the right, though some St Emilions did quite well. Many wines to my palate lacked fruit intensity and came across as rather astringent. Ageing them was risky as the structure of the wine when young was evident more than fruit.

The British critics seemed to like this vintage. Jancis Robinson for example liked the freshness after the 2003 vintage, an extreme vintage whether you like it or not.

My suggestions are St Juliens and the better right bank wines, though I’ve gilded down even Castillon wines that were pretty good for their price.

Posted: **Wed Feb 15, 2023 2:50 am**

JimHow wrote: ↑Tue Feb 14, 2023 10:22 am It was you I thought of when I suggested SHL, Bobby G, I’m surprised it’s not on your list.

I do no't think it may be modern enuff...it has alot of classic character...he's asking for modern style

Peby Faugeres would be another one

Posted: **Wed Feb 15, 2023 1:35 pm**

Correct. While my personal interest is with the more classical producers, I figured I would look for a more modern producer for my nephew. He has tried wine in the past, and while not really "into it" as of yet, he does like it. He "wasn't sure" if he liked the 2014 Sociando Mallet he tried over Xmas...which means he probably didn't haha. That's why I was thinking maybe a Poyferre, Pape Clement, or Pontet-Canet might be more in his wheelhouse. After reading notes on these wines, they all seem to have some nice fruit still...which is what I was hoping for.

Posted: **Wed Feb 15, 2023 6:12 pm**

If you can find the 2004 Conseillante at a reasonable price I’d be all over that, it’s very hedonistic but subtle and elegant at the same time…

Discussion of Gruaud in another thread reminded me that the 2004 Gruaud is also excellent, if perhaps not obvious enough for your nephew

Posted: **Wed Feb 15, 2023 8:27 pm**

Troplong Mondot would def. fit the bill

Posted: **Thu Feb 16, 2023 2:35 pm**

StBlGT wrote: ↑Sun Feb 12, 2023 5:54 pm Thanks Jim and stefan, for those suggestions. I forgot about Malescot. Did Poyferre, Pape Clement, or Pontet-Canet make a good wine in this vintage?

Regarding 2004, I’ve had that vintage of Pavie twice and it convinced me that the “old” Pavie actually did not need fixing, I regularly bought Pavie up until the mid 90s and always liked it. Some older wines are among the best wines I’ve ever had.

The 2004 Pavie tasted like an over Oakes new world Merlot. Well made, clean, rich and quite frankly boring. The oak was too powerful and dominated the fruit rather than complimenting it. But the older Pavie had such complex and interesting flavours - the new style does not to my palate thus I’ve not bought a bottle for twenty odd years. Oh well.

Posted: **Thu Feb 16, 2023 3:45 pm**

Claudius...I would like the try the real Pavie...what older vintages do u recommend? Thx

Posted: **Thu Feb 16, 2023 3:49 pm**

Papa Doc used to love the old Pavie.

Posted: **Fri Feb 17, 2023 1:44 am**

Because of this thread, I opened a 2004 Leoville Barton tonight to drink with hangar steak. It is a well balanced, very classical St Julien; just wonderful for Bordeaux lovers. Clearly not the wine you are looking for.

Posted: **Fri Feb 17, 2023 3:54 am**

marcs wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 6:12 pm If you can find the 2004 Conseillante at a reasonable price I’d be all over that, it’s very hedonistic but subtle and elegant at the same time…

Another vote for Conseillante in this situation. Gateway drug.

Posted: **Fri Feb 17, 2023 4:44 am**

2004 leo.Barton is a cracker...it can hang with with the 2000 and '96

Posted: **Fri May 03, 2024 5:21 pm**

Gerry M. wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 2:43 am The 2004 Ch Clerc Milon has always impressed me as an over achiever.

I recently had the 2004 Clerc and wow what a wine. I have 2004 Duhart to drink next and currently bidding on 2004 Montrose.

My Clerc Milon 2004 Notes:

The bottle had sediment and a slight bricking on the rim. The wine had a complex aroma of perfume, cherry, dried herbs, black currant, pine, and some barnyard. The aroma changed constantly and was very interesting. The taste was medium, with juicy red fruit, cocoa, prune, dried herbs, menthol, and chocolate. After some time, some potting soil showed up along with wet tobacco. The tannins were medium and silky, and the acidity was medium. The finish was very long. We drank it over three hours and had a great time. 93pts

Posted: **Sun May 05, 2024 6:31 am**

I had Canon-la-Gaffeliere 2004 a few times over the last months and it is a great wine. I had Pichon Baron, Leoville Poyferre (which where the best from the left side that I had) and many others of the already mentioned Bdxs, but none of them had been better, especially if you consider the price. I got it for € 55,-, so I think there is a great QPR (but I have to mention that there is some bottle variation too!). I love Pape Clement from the 80's till the early 2000's, but 2004 has been at the rear end, same with Pontet Canet. Not bad, but nothing special. For me (a left bank lover) the "Right-Bankers" performed a little better in the long run than those from the left bank. (I have Angelus and Conseillante in my cellar untouched, but maybe I have to try them?) Just my subjecitve opinion...cheers!
PS: it's my first post here, have been just reading so far...so please excuse my english

Posted: **Mon May 06, 2024 1:15 pm**

Chrysostomus wrote: ↑Sun May 05, 2024 6:31 am I had Canon-la-Gaffeliere 2004 a few times over the last months and it is a great wine. I had Pichon Baron, Leoville Poyferre (which where the best from the left side that I had) and many others of the already mentioned Bdxs, but none of them had been better, especially if you consider the price. I got it for € 55,-, so I think there is a great QPR (but I have to mention that there is some bottle variation too!). I love Pape Clement from the 80's till the early 2000's, but 2004 has been at the rear end, same with Pontet Canet. Not bad, but nothing special. For me (a left bank lover) the "Right-Bankers" performed a little better in the long run than those from the left bank. (I have Angelus and Conseillante in my cellar untouched, but maybe I have to try them?) Just my subjecitve opinion...cheers!
PS: it's my first post here, have been just reading so far...so please excuse my english

Congrats on your first post, and thanks for left bank vs right tidbit for 2004

Posted: **Mon May 06, 2024 11:26 pm**

SHL is a gem
Reserve comtesse too

Posted: **Mon May 06, 2024 11:55 pm**

Thanks for posting, Chry, and as Jay said, welcome!
2004 gets good reviews here on BWE, it may be about time I crack open my case of 2004 Pontet Can't.

Bordeaux Wine Enthusiasts

2004 Vintage

2004 Vintage

Re: 2004 Vintage

Re: 2004 Vintage

Re: 2004 Vintage

Re: 2004 Vintage

Re: 2004 Vintage

Re: 2004 Vintage

Re: 2004 Vintage

Re: 2004 Vintage

Re: 2004 Vintage

Re: 2004 Vintage

Re: 2004 Vintage

Re: 2004 Vintage

Re: 2004 Vintage

Re: 2004 Vintage

Re: 2004 Vintage

Re: 2004 Vintage

Re: 2004 Vintage

Re: 2004 Vintage

Re: 2004 Vintage

Re: 2004 Vintage

Re: 2004 Vintage

Re: 2004 Vintage

Re: 2004 Vintage

Re: 2004 Vintage

Re: 2004 Vintage

Re: 2004 Vintage

Re: 2004 Vintage

Re: 2004 Vintage

Re: 2004 Vintage

Re: 2004 Vintage

Re: 2004 Vintage

Re: 2004 Vintage

Re: 2004 Vintage

Re: 2004 Vintage

Re: 2004 Vintage

Re: 2004 Vintage

Re: 2004 Vintage

Re: 2004 Vintage