TN: 1998 Clos de l'Oratoire (France, Bordeaux, Libournais, St. Émilion Grand Cru)

[JimHow]

• 1998 Clos de l'Oratoire - France, Bordeaux, Libournais, St. Émilion Grand Cru (11/10/2010)
  It was funny to look back at my notes from April 2009, my last experience with this wine. I rated it 93 points then. I said I didn't care if people thought it was "too modern," etc., it was just an enjoyable wine, so there.... Well, a year and a half later, I think maybe it is indeed a little too modern. I am certainly not rating it 93 points today. Nevertheless, I would not characterize it as a "disappointment." It is a jammy, black-fruited, licorice-dominated, big, roadside-tar kind of wine. It ended up doing a lot better with food, tonight being pork chop, vegetable, and chocolate whoopie pie dessert. This is definitely not a sit-around-the-loft kind of wine that you sip while philosophizing about the latest meanderings in the Sunday New York Times Book Review section. This is not exactly "Bordeaux," but I'll take it over "California" any day of the week. Still very young and quite primary. Unique purple/maroon color. I have no idea whether/how much this wine will improve. (91 pts.)

Posted from CellarTracker

[Chasse-Spleen]

It doesn't seem to me like that wine is really going anywhere, by the way that you describe it. But then, it's hard to imagine that Parkerization was in full swing way back in 1998. Then again, maybe that was why RP rated the '98 Right Bank vintage so highly. Just a thought...
-Chasse

[DavidG]

Interesting take. I find for my palate "modern" wines (if you define those as lots of really ripe or even jammy fruit, more alcohol perhaps not totally covered by the fruit, lower acid, maybe more oak) tend to go better as pre-dinner "cocktails" or after-dinner sippers, while more "traditional" wines tend to go better with food.

[alchemeus]

I think I have some of this (3+, less than 6). Not sure if I've tried one as I've tried to keep the 1998 Right Bankers in the racks. 93 to 91 doesn't really mean anything to me.

I have quaffed a few 2000 Bordeaux and for my palate they do not come near the 1996's, which I tried a few of, fell in love with them, and drank most of them up.

Had most of my 1999 Bordeaux, maybe a few left, I know the Palmer is still there, at least 3 of them.

Hoping the Margaux and Haut Brion and Lafitte will last another 12 years for retirement. Can't even remember the year on those.

I know you folk only drink the finest, but I honestly don't see how you can really appreciate them unless you drink other wines. I mean, I don't drink dreck (but I have bought a few bottles to try that were) but some nice wines. But when I go back to Bordeaux or Burgundy or Rhone, it's just SO FUCKING AMAZING! They taste so much better than what I remember from drinking only the best.

Different strokes and so forth.

[DavidG]

I know you folk only drink the finest

How do you know that, Alch? By ignoring all the posts on sub-$20 wines and only reading the notes on the expensive ones?

[stefan]

David, maybe he knows that our sub $20 wines are among the best wines in the world.

[alchemeus]

I know you folk only drink the finest

How do you know that, Alch? By ignoring all the posts on sub-$20 wines and only reading the notes on the expensive ones?

David, c'mon! I've known you guys since 2000. I've read you'r evaluations of wine. I've read your dismissals.

Are you now telling me you've came around to my opinion?

Glad if you have.

But I doubt it.

Don't try and bullshit me, I was here in 2000.

[JimHow]

Hey Alch, what have you been up to?
What have you been drinking lately?

[DavidG]

No BS in this thread, Alch. Your impressions from 10 years ago may be correct to some degree, but they are seriously out of date. I'm not going to take the time to post links to all of my TNs, but if you were to look for them (CT handle dbg), you would find that over the past year I have drunk and posted on more inexpensive '07 Cotes-du-Rhones than on any other category. Stefan said it best: our sub-$20 wines are among the best in the world.

As to your premise - I agree that diversity is important and refreshing and keeps one appreciative of the bounty and variety of wines that are out there. That doesn't mean I want to drink average wines most of the time to be able to appreciate the great ones, but they can offer great pleasure and also serve as references and palate calibrators.

Anyway, I don't mean to chase you off with negative attitude. It was a long day and I'm feeling much better now after dinner and a nice glass of Cab. I'd rather encourage you to visit more often and stay up to date with the stuff we're currently drinking - and keep us up to date with what you're up to. You'll find were not nearly as elitist as you might think.

[alchemeus]

Hey Alch, what have you been up to?
What have you been drinking lately?

It's been a suck year Jim. Brother, Mother, step Mother, Mother in law all die within 6 months, Hell of a cost too.

Been sucking down my cellar of great wines. Bordeaux and Burgundy and Rhone rules!

now can only buy cheaper wines, but some great ones found. Live large my friend. Enjoy life.

[JimHow]

Ah, I'm really sorry to hear about all that. Life is just way, way too tenuous. Well, just try to keep an even keel, I hope we get to share a glass or two sometime in the not too distant future.

[Comte Flaneur]

Sorry about your losses Alch and welcome back...enjoy your sometimes cryptic posts, this place is a good refuge

[alchemeus]

Obladih oblahdah, life goes on...

Yeah, but I've found insurance companies are the worst.

Don't get me started.

[alchemeus]

Ah, I'm really sorry to hear about all that. Life is just way, way too tenuous. Well, just try to keep an even keel, I hope we get to share a glass or two sometime in the not too distant future.

Jim, whenever you get to DC let me know. I'm buying.

[JimHow]

Okay, sounds good, I'll bring along a certain wine from the Bages plateau of Pauillac that has been known to offer up black-fruit and lead pencil enjoyment for several decades now....

Maybe sometime this winter/spring....

[alchemeus]

Okay, sounds good, I'll bring along a certain wine from the Bages plateau of Pauillac that has been known to offer up black-fruit and lead pencil enjoyment for several decades now....

Maybe sometime this winter/spring....

Ah the inevitable 1989 Lynch-Bages.

An Arcana of BWE. From the first.