2008 Bordeaux Right Bank tasting

[Claudius2]

Tasting was put on in very cool premises and wines were opened 1 hr before tasting.
Tasting was composed of 9 wines, 7 St Emilions and 2 Pomerols.
Interstingly, there is a distinct vintage character here.
The wines are medium bodied, with a consistent character that suggests good uniformity of conditions.
The 2 Pomerols (Clinet and Gazin) were meatier, more savoury and spicier, but the density of all wines was medium bodied.
Density was slightly higher in the more expensive wines but that does not equate (in my mind) with quality.

No failures or absolute winners were evident though I must say the style of these wine was consistently good.
I have never had much time for the "vintage of the century" crap by the way.
This vintage shows very pleasant wines for medium term drinking rather than tannic monsters (like 2005) or fruit bombs.

I think this is a good value vintage with wines that offer enjoyable drinking without waiting for decades.

Now, the stupid order was in Parker points which I have to say has nothing to do with the quality of the wines.
Sorry but it really pisses me that retailers stick RP points all over labels. But better stop......

One point - I will never do 100 points thus I use a nominal scale.
So what the f... does 90 points actually taste like???

Beausajour Duffau Lagarrosse
First wine tried. RP probably did not like it. So what cares.
Colour is bright purple red, not black but with a bright dark red core.
Nose - MUCH too cold initially - showed wood and acid. Guys, 8-10 degrees celsius too too cold!!
Anyway, it took a lot of time to show its hand. Woodsmoke, vanilla, earth, violets, plums and sweet red fruits. Quite complex.
Palate was very nice, medium bodied, soft acid, tannins present but in balance, good density and linearity.
Fruit is merlotish - red and black fruits, yet well integrated and complex. Not a simple fruit bomb here.
With time and warmth, the sweeter fruit, anise and earthiness showed.
One of the top wines of the showing and for 5-10 years ageing.
Rated excellent+

Barde Haut
Black/red colour, quite full.
Nose of vanilla bean, spice, black fruits.
Palate was pleasant, medium bodied, a bit acidic initially, with dark plums.
Maybe the wine is a bit simple and without mid palate density but is is good in its own way.
Seems like the oak has been a bit heavy for the fruit??
For short to medium term.
Not a bad wine yet maybe the least impressive of the tasting.
Good to very good. Drink over next 5 years. Not for long ageing.

Figeac
Lowest alcohol and most cab sav of the whole tasting.
Colour was dark red, not black but medium dark with a nice red/pink meniscus.
Nose was very fruit driven with ample flowers - violets, rose, etc.
Arguably the nicest nose of all the wines as it was like a summer flower bed.
Palate was medium bodied, with fleshy, earthy fuit, good acidity, some tannins and red fruits.
Need time - showed better with more air and the vanilla oak, spice and red fruits integrated better.
Not a heavy wine - can see why RP is not mad on this estate.
Pity, as I really liked the balance and length on the palate, and it will last for some years.
Rated excellent. One of my fav St Emilions for 30 odd years I have to say.
Keep 7-12 years.

La Confession
Not tried this wine before.
Medium dark colour, black/red core and pink/red meniscus.
Nose was overtly oaky - vanilla, spices, slightly nutty.
Palate was softly fruity, red fruits, plums and flowers.
The fruit is quite sweet, and the wood is a bit overbearing now.
Most commerical style of the wines and it is a very good wine in its own right though it drew quite opposing views.
A few locals liked the sweetness and vanilla flavours, others found it like a Calfornian Merlot.
Make up your own mind.
A very good wine in its own right, though a St Emilion? Whatever.
Drink 3-8 years. Not for long keeping. Wonder what will develop.

Clos Fourtet
Mahogany red colour, red/black core, seemed a little more developed than others. Yet nice density.
Nose was soft, lots of vanilla oak and spice, soft red fruit, lower acid thaqn others.
Palate was of sweet, quite primary red fruits, and a thickish oaky mouthfeel - a little overpowering initially but I think it will integrate.
There is some spice and powdery red fruits to balance the overt vanilla oak.
A little shy now, though it started to open well.
There is some ripeness to this wine, and some found it too ripe, yet the structure is there for development.
I find the style a bit commerical but in its own right, it is very good to excellent.
Drink 3-10 years.

Clinet (Pomerol)
Darkish colour - black red with solid core.
Nose and palate was of soft red fruits, vanilla, and savoury, meaty characters.
The Pomerol characters here stuck out - a more savouory (Italianate??) character that adds complexity.
Quite young.
It is very good but maybe over-priced and the structure is a bit blowsy to me.
Drink 3-8 years.

Gazin
Nice dark red, red/purple meniscus and red/black core.
Nose was very savoury, spicy, meaty and slightly animally. Yet lots of red fruits as well.
Palate was rich, medium to full bodied, ripe red fruit, quite fleshy.
I like this wine better than Clinet and it is much cheaper.
There is considerable vanilla/spice oak but good density of red fruits.
It is not an obvious, sweet, vanilla bean wine but one that grows on you.
Anyway, I rated this as the best of the tasting.
Others preferred the Clinet, yet they like Sav Blanc so I disregared their views...
Excellent plus.

Pavie Macquin
This wine is getting expensive thus I wondered if the wine lives up to it.
Dark red/black, red at the meniscus.
Distinctly aniseed, spice and plums on the nose.
The anise really stands out and shows very ripe fruits, more black than red.
The biggest wine of the tasting and appears to be the youngest - the meaty, spicy oaky wine has not integrated but is promising.
There is a creamy, oaky character to the palate, reminding me of the Clos Fourtet but with a but more complexity.
Yet this needs time. Revert is 5 years??
I actually like this wine despite a touch of bitter oak tannins at the end, though some found the anise and black fruits too much (more like new world cab/merlot) yet there is no doubting its quality.
And no wonder RP likes it.....
Sorry but if the retailers give me one more RP score I'll puke.

Rated excellent. May be outstanding in 5-10 years. Though it may be overly woody in five years as well. This concern bumped it down a few places.
Leave till 2018 at least.

Troplong Mondot
Priciest and highest RP point wine. Cough.....
Good dark red/black, nice core and bright red/purple meniscus. Young.
Nose of sweet and dense red fruits, a touch clunky if that makes sense.
Quite powerful, more Pomerol like than St E with red/black fruits, smoke, earth, savoury, meaty characters.
Very young and primary. The finish is a bit hard and bitter but this clearly needs some time.
Excellent - may warrant an outstanding rating in 10 years.
Leave in a cool dark place for now.

So the wines I liked best:
1. Gazin
2. Figeac (interestingly, I rated this the best initially, second tasting I preferrd the Gazin so there goes)
3. Beausejour DL
4. Pavie Macquin
5. Troplong Mondot
6. Clos Fourtet
7. Clinet
8. La Confession
9. Barde Haut

If I was entrely buying for longer term cellaring, the TM and PM would move up.
Interestingly, the two cheapest wines were the lowest rated, yet the highest priced were in the middle. Hmmm.

[DavidG]

Thanks for the excellent report - you made me look up prices and availability on a few of these even though I've sworn off any more Bdx purchases.

I do think your notes would be more useful if you didn't rely so heavily on the 100-point scale.

[Claudius2]

David
Cough.....
Anyway, the wines are not in the to die for category but what impressed me was the consistency of them.
I'm going to a left abnk 08 tasting in 2 weeks which will be an interesting comparison.

[Bacchus]

Claudius2, you are hilarious. It's been some time since a tasting note has made laugh so. Cry certainly . . . well now we're back to the royal one, aren't we. Like David, you got me thinking about the 08s. It truly may be the last affordable vintage. But you also got me thinking about some of the earlier, recent vintages of the wines you review, esp '06. Thanks for a great read.

[Claudius2]

Bacchus
Putting his majesty aside, I am actually finding Cellartracker a useful resource as I can get an idea of quality from drinkers and not tasters.
Maybe at 54 I'm getting too old and jaundiced for more annoucements about the next great vintage et al.

A few things that did worry me about the wines were the alcohol levels - Figeac had 13.5% and the others were 13.9% to 14.5%.
The wines were not overly jammy but I thought a few (Clinet, Confession in particular) were pushing it a bit.
The other worry is new oak.
It is now 11.30pm and I can still taste new oak in my mouth and the 2001 Pontet Canet drank over dinner was adversely affected by the wood tannins attahced to my palate. How anyone can drink hundreds of wines a day and get any idea of their quality is beyond me.
Oh well.

The 08 vintage to my palate is a bit more black fruit than 06, which was more red fruit dominated.
I think 08 is a bit more consistent and on the basis of recent tastings, I'd say 08 is a also bit better.
The 06 vintage has developed well though, and the 04 vintage is good too if not irregular.
Yet my strategy is to buy the wines I like from a range of vintages as if I could only drink one vintage it would get pretty boring.
I ignore the really poor years though since the early 90s, (91 to 93 are below par) there have been few bad vintages.

My other point is that since 2000, the vintage are stylistically very different yet none are disasters (though most 03s are undrinkable to me).
I do however now have a good view of all vintages from 2000 to 2008, and this is why points are nonsense.
A 92 point wine in say, 2002 (well balanced, medium bodied, dry, food style), is going to be totally different in style from 2003 (ugh - burnt fruit, plums, low acid) or 2005 (tannic for decades I think).

[Bacchus]

Thanks for the run down, Claudius. I think our palettes dove-tail, even though they might not be identical. I don't mind wines that don't overpower my mouth and taste buds, and I appreciate subtlety, complexity, and layering. I'm quite happy with '04 and '06, for example; although I'd never turn down a good 05. I figure if I stock up on 04-06 and 08 I'll have enough for some very good drinking for a very long time. If need be, I can augment that with some good scotch.

[AlexR]

Claudius,

A superb post! Thanks for sharing.

If you thought alcohol was high in 2008, just wait 'till you come into contact with the 2009s and 10s!!!

I went to large scale en-primeur tastings in both of those vintages, and the alcohol seemed too high in many, many cases.

One of the primary virtues of Bordeaux is to be "digestible" - to have half a bottle at lunch and still have all your wits about you the rest of the afternoon.

You CANNOT do that with 14.5/15° plus wines...
BUT, when wines need to stand it to get points in order to sell at high prices, this is what you get...

All the best,
Alex

[Claudius2]

Alex
That is a worry.
What happened to Bordeaux at 12.5% alcohol in good vintages??

If they are coming in at 15%, they are rivalling barossa shiraz, and I have to say that shiraz deals with hi alcohol better than cabs and merlot.

[JonoB]

Completely agree... But then everywhere seems to be getting higher alcohols. Including Burgundy, except 2011 where the worry is that some may Chaptalise too much.

Perhaps people need to start picking earlier and extracting less from the grapes if the seeds are not perfectly ripe?

There is no reason why a wine with 11% can't age beautifully. It just has to be balanced and away you go.

[AlexR]

A little personal history here.
I came to Bordeaux in 1978 from Napa Valley.
I was struck at the time by how perfumed and elegant the Bordeaux wines were... but how weak!

The name wines had an alcoholic degree of 11.5, maybe 12 at that time.

Between climate change, Parker points, and the desire for concentration and wines that "explode on the palate", people who drink wine regularly are left somewhat bewildered.

I also think that quite a few consumers drink wine only occasionaly. When they do, they want something that impresses. And that facet has become a new yardstick...

I can remember when I first read about fine wine and had never tasted any. I thought that the greatest wines would be big and invasive (albeit in a very pleasurable sort of way).
Experience showed me that the best wines - please forgive me for stating the obvious - are all about balance and subtlety.

Best regards,
Alex R.

[DavidG]

I agree that the best wines have to be balanced - though I wouldn't say it is "all" about balance. Balance is a necessary condition for a wine to be great, but not a sufficient condition.

I don't agree that a wine has to be subtle to be great, though I'm not sure if that is exactly what you are saying, Alex. Some great wines get there on the basis of subtlety, others on the basis of power, yet others based on complexity or some combination of these factors. This is where things get subjective, as some people appreciate only certain styles of great wines. A great wine can be far from subtle. It can be bold and still balanced. There are wines with 14% alcohol that have balancing fruit, acidity and tannin. They may not be a style that appeals to all, but style is a different issue from balance. The inebriation issue is a real one, though, as you can't drink a 1/2 bottle of 14-15% juice without feeling it. This is limiting.

[Claudius2]

David
Quite an erudite comment.
There were only a few wines that were overly woody in my mind and a few that were pushing it alcohol wise.
The Clinet was a worry as it did not seem to handle the alchol but agian, others are more acepting of this than me.
The Barde Haut, Confession, and to a point, Pavie M and Clos Fourtet, were a bit hot, but it was really only in the Pavie M that worried me, which is why I was concerned about the longevity and style of the wine (though it is well made and lavished with very good oak!).
When I smell overt aniseed, I think of Victorian Durif or Barossa SHiraz in a warm year.

I think ther Clos Fourtet was not overtly hot, and I liked the wine anywhay, but it lacks a bit of grip, and that is a common issue with high alcohol wine.
For that reason, the alc levels shocked me. Some were very nice nontheless but that was when the alc was balanced by aciidy and ripe but not over-ripe fruit.

[JonB]

Claudius2 - thanks for posting your observations.

What other vintage characteristics did you observe for the 2008s? (or perhaps you want to wait on this until the left bank tasting).

Many of the wines seemed to have bitter acidity when I tasted them at a UGC event back in January, and I haven't tried a single 2008 since. Yes, alcohol is high and the wines are generally dark in color.

[Claudius2]

Jon
The wines were all right bank thus can't generalise to the left bank.
I did not notice bitter acidity at all.
Most had a decent balance of fruit, oak, acid and tannins.
Overall, they are medium bodied, realtively "modern" in style for the right bank in that there was quite hi alcohol, ripeness and vanilla/spice from new oak.

Acidity in itself does not give bitterness.
I wonder however if the wines you tried had too many bitter tannins??

A few of the fines could ahve done with a touch more acidity to blance the alcohol.

[JonoB]

Bitterness will come from unripe seeds and skins beeing pressed to oblivion in neumatic presses... Giving as Claudius says bitter tannins. The best will be those who don't use too much press juice and don't press too hard! However, there is so much juice in Bordeaux to begin with, it may just be certain batches if the bottles are bottled direct from barrel as oppose to blended and then bottled.

Of course, this all depends on the winemakers and their philosophies. Most will blend before bottling after barreling, and it may be left over lees and yeastiness that will include a bit of skin and pips at the bottom of tanks that may give this flavour as well when bottling.

Of course, ti will only be the few bottles as they will make sure that as little of Thr juice near the bottom gets into bottled wine, but obviously it may also depend on how much of production was sold on the futures market!

[Houndsong]

The PoD rated the 2008 Right Bank vintage 96 points, which is to say as "good" as 1998 and only eclipsed by 2000 in the preceding 19 vintages at least. Yet you seem unmoved. What's your problem, Mark?

[Claudius2]

Hound
Well, I clearly should base my views on points assigned by others.
Urr, no....

Having said that, 08 is a very good right bnak vintage though it is NOT is the realm of greatness to this little black duck.
What is PoD anyway?

[Claudius2]

Hound
One more point.
Just drank an absolutely delcicious 2002 Burgundy - Humbert Gevry Chambertin 1er Cru Poissenot.

My conclusion is that 02 in Burgundy is better than 08 in Bordeaux.
So work that logic out.

[Houndsong]

PoD="Prince of Darkness"

<sarcasm>You're going way out on a limb there with your 02 burg beats 08 right bank call.</sarcasm>

I've yet to try an 08 RB. I have some 08 Fonroque in the pipeline though.

[Claudius2]

Hound
I have 6 bottles of the Fonroque.
Seriously, I like the 08 RB vintage a lot, and have actually bought a lot of wines, in most cases, 6 bottles. So far I bought:

Fonroque
Larcis Ducasse
Beausejour DL (also bought 12 half bottles - really like this wine)
Clos Fortet
Gazin
Nenin
Figeac
La Confession (purchased before trying. Bit undecided)
Dominique
L'arossee
Clos Oratoire
Fleur Cardinale
Rouget
Moulin St Georges

So that represents a lot of plonk!
These wines were about half the price on clearance sale as the 09s and I do not want to wait 20 years before I can drink them anyway.
As I get older, I seem to be getting more interested in the right bank - maybe the softer fruit is getting to me.

The only Medocs I bought are two old favs - Lagrange St Julien and Leoville Barton.
Not tried the LB yet but the Lagrange is a pretty good wine.
Not in the class of say 1990 but very good in its own right.

The point about 02 Burgundies are that they are starting to drink beautifully.
Love Gevrys from the vintage - earth, truffle, dark cherry, savoury characters, yum!

[stefan]

Mark, the 2002 Burgundies have come around much more quickly than I expected. In general they are much more approachable than the 1999s.

[Claudius2]

stefan
Agreed.
Over the last year or two they have developed considerably.
I'd drink over the next 5 years except for the very top wines.