2011 Pricing still sucks

[Chateau Vin]

2011 ex-negociant pricing in Euros (Up/Down from 2010). Let's see what's in store with regards to pricing from others...Let's give the evil-pricing rating (from 1 to 5) to the chateaux...

Lafite: 420 (-30%)
Cos: 108 (-50%)
Gazin: 42 (-12.5%)
Sociando Mallet 20.40 (-8.11%)
Bellevue 35 (-21.5%)
Suduirat 45 (-7.2%)

[JonB]

I just received my first futures offer....2011 Cos d'Estournel $164/bottle, JS92-93, WS 90-93....and Pagodes de Cos $49/bottle JS88-89, WS 89-92.
Far too pricey for me.....perhaps RP reviews will make it seem more like a value.

[JimHow]

What's the gossip on the quality/style of the 2011s?

[JonB]

From the little I've read, it seems to be an irregular vintage, with Pomerol perhaps the best AOC, and perhaps comparable to 2001 or 2008, with lower alcohol levels than 2009 and 2010, and bright acidity.

[Chateau Vin]

What's the gossip on the quality/style of the 2011s?

JonB precisely mentioned the overall take on 2011, but here is how some of the wines fared in the eyes of BBR for what it's worth...I guess you are going for LB if the price is favorable?

A Classically-Structured Vintage
Indications from our barrel tastings suggest that those who have produced gems will be similar to 1996 in terms of style, but even those who haven’t made wines of blockbuster appeal will not be bad – considering the advances made in winemaking technology during recent years.

The good news is that this 2011 vintage is likely to have produced lovely drinking Bordeaux to fill up your cellars, with those that bought 2002, 2004 and 2008 aware of what great value these wines are and of course how delicious they are.

According to Parker's early comments:

" ...tasting 2011s was more fun than I thought-despite the unusually mediocre summer, the wines are ripe, deeply colored, very aromatic, generally quite pure, medium weight, and with higher acids than the two great years of 2009 and 2010...the bottom line is that the vintage is better than I expected...." (erobertparker.com - on Mark Squires' blog, March 2012)

The Best Wines of the Vintage

Domaine de Chevalier Blanc 19.5
Ch. Haut-Brion Blanc 19
Ch. Latour 19
Ch. Ducru-Beaucaillou 18.5
Ch. Figeac 18.5
Ch. Haut-Bailly 18.5
Ch. Lynch-Bages 18.5
Ch. Palmer 18.5
Ch. Pontet-Canet 18.5
Ch. d'Yquem 18.5
Ch. Léoville Las Cases 18
Ch. Léoville-Poyferré 18
Ch. Pichon Baron 18

[JimHow]

Thanks for the reports. I would think Lynch would be on my list of possible purchases if the price is right.

[Bacchus]

Buy 04. Hard to get better prices than the 04s, and they've got 8 years on them already.

[Bacchus]

I took a look at what Chris Kissack has to say about the vintage over on his site. He has yet to post his assessment of the right bank, but he's posted a region-by-region break down of the left, as well as reviews of a good number of left bank wines. Based on all that, with the possible exception of Pauillac, it looks like 2011 is behind the quality of 2008; St. Estephe and St. Julien only slightly so. But Margaux and Pessac seem to have really suffered, with lots of scores from Margaux in the 12-13 range. Even Ch. Margaux received a rating of only 16-17! Meanwhile in Pessac things seem to be only slightly better, with scores in the 14-15 range dominating, and with Haut Bailly (at 16-17) outperforming Haut Brion (15.5-16.5), if only just! Pauillac is more of a mixed bag in comparison to its 08 offerings; some performing at 08 levels, some not, while others exceeded their 08 performance. So as a whole it looks like the northern regions did better than the south, at least on the left side. It also looks like the consumer will have to be careful and highly selective in purchasing the wines of 2011. On the other hand, since 08 is generally better in quality and price, perhaps the only interest in 2011 will be by those wanting to complete certain verticals.

[Houndsong]

Yeah, 2011 is better than "+" expected. Which should put it about at 08, which turned out much worse than he expected - although he didn't ever admit it.

[Bacchus]

Since the prices of 2011 "suck", I thought it appropriate to share the namesake's opinion. This is quoted from an interview he did with Liv-Ex:

What are the defining characteristics of the vintage?

Denis Durantou of Eglise Clinet explained it to me best. If you look at it analytically, the wines tend to have the same of amount of tannin as in 2010 and the same acidity level, but with around one degree less alcohol. So what you have are skinny, lanky wines that are not that big and voluptuous. I suppose you could describe them as slightly emaciated models.

What is good about the vintage?

The vintage harks back to the classic style of Bordeaux. It has a slight austerity and firmness with a nice perfume.

I have been tasting from barrel since 1982 and I was recently trying to remember what the wines remind me of. Perhaps 1986, with which it shares a tannic structure, although there aren’t the same highlights in 2011 that we saw in 1986, such as Mouton or Las Cases. Or maybe even 1975, but more modern, with riper tannins. Qualitatively, I think we are at the same level as 2004 (which I feel is underrated) or 2001. But stylistically, I would have to say 1986 or 1975.

I would say it is better than 1996, which is overrated apart from the very top Medoc wines, and it is better than 2008, which has a really high acidity that I don’t get on with.

Full interview: http://www.jamessuckling.com/liv-ex-int ... -2011.html

[DavidG]

Bacchus - did he really say better than 1996, or is that a typo? If he meant better then 1986, I have to say that those wines have been turning out nicely. It just took a lot of patience for them to come around, but the fruit was indeed there to outlast the tannins in a lot of the wines.

If Suckling is correct, this ought to be a vintage that lovers of "classic" Bdx should enjoy. You know, the ones RP calls the "anti-flaor wine elite." But I suspect prices are still going to be too high for anyone to get really enthusiastic about these wines, at least en primeur.

[Bacchus]

Ya, David, as far as I can see he really meant 1996 -- he thinks the vintage is overrated! All those who went to DC, however, should be able to enlighten us! Is Suckling right, or does he suck? Or better yet, since he thinks 2004 is underrated, maybe we need to conduct a '96/'04 showdown! RobertGoulet can compare the two vintages of SHL since he's so big on the 04. I don't have a lot of '96s, but I have both of Cos! We'll let Mr. Suckling know the truth . . .

[JimHow]

James Suckling is a damned good looking man but we've always known he is biased against 1996....

[Bacchus]

Maybe so Jim, but he lives in Tuscany:
https://skydrive.live.com/?cid=fc60ee55 ... 7CB78D!164

[DavidG]

Meanwhile, back at the ranch...

Calvert Woodly in DC just sent an email offer for 2011 Lafite at $689.

Pass. Even if I were still buying futures and even if the '11s were as good as the '96s (better? fuggedaboudit!): Pass.

[Chateau Vin]

Received futures offers of $149 and $64 from JJBuckley for Cos and Gazin respectively...It was an easy decision...Pass

[stefan]

Get this: A Texas distributer is trying to wholesale '08 Cos for $206 per bottle!

[DavidG]

Per 750? Really? What is he smokin'?

[stefan]

It must be something strong, David. He is sitting on 11 1/2 cases. Maybe he likes being so high up.

[Bacchus]

I guess this article sums it up -- pricing strategy on a go-forward basis seems pretty clear:
http://www.decanter.com/bordeaux-2011/e ... ce-of-2010

[JimHow]

I spend about one-tenth as much on wine these days as I used to.

[Chateau Vin]

Don't know how good is 2011 Sociando, but under $30 seems comparable to other similar vintages...Following is an interesting article from decanter...Geez it has become parker prices instead of simply parker scores. When will it stop even in so so vintage?

'Things are inching forward, but we have so far had a muted response to the campaign,' Simon Quinn of Bordeaux Wine Investments told Decanter.com. 'It's seems likely now that chateaux are waiting for Robert Parker's scores, due out next week.
..........
............
...............
In London, Stephen Browett of Farr Vintners said Lafite was the only wine to sell so far this year.

‘Lafite is nearly sold out but nothing else has sold at all. Unless wines are offered at genuinely interesting prices – ie cheaper than the consumer can buy physical vintages – then I can’t see any interest at all, except for maybe the vintage’s handful of top-rated wines.’

[Claudius2]

Chateau Vin
Since Lafite has not been released yet over here in Asia, I am a bit surprised it has "nearly sold out".
I gather that is just one retailer??

The local importers are trying to talk up 2011 but so far have found little interest.

[Chateau Vin]

Chateau Vin
Since Lafite has not been released yet over here in Asia, I am a bit surprised it has "nearly sold out".
I gather that is just one retailer??

The local importers are trying to talk up 2011 but so far have found little interest.

That is just one retailer, that too in UK... Here in US, you can still buy 2011 Lafite. Also, I presume the yields might be lower due to uncooperative weather and they might have made fewer cases than previous years...Or may be Lafite just released less in the first tranche and after testing the market response, they might release more in the subsequent tranches...Or, who knows if Lafite is also following Latour and stocking up by releasing less and less to retailers to get out of en premieur system in the future...

[Nicklasss]

Up to now, the 2011 vintage prices are not encouraging anyone to buy.

It is like the repetiton of the 1997 vintage future prices, after the 1995 and 1996.

And from what we can read, better buy the 2008 still available.

Nic