Top 2005s languishing on shelves in NH

[JimHow]

Quite a sight to see La Mission at $899, LLC at $425, Pavie at $400, Latour at $1600, etc., etc., just sitting out there on the open shelves in the Hampton North store. My fear had been that the sucker American wine consumer would buy these wines but apparently not. It gives me a little faith, and does this represent a harbinger of a financial earthquake to come in the world of Bordeaux? In my experience, if they can't sell them at these prices in NH, where prices are generally marked up minimally, they can't sell them anywhere!

[Claudius]

Jim,
The importers in Aust are having the same issue.
Great vintage, ugly prices.
Some are being sent off to auction and most are not reaching low estimates.

I just can;t see the point of paying $1600 for Latour.
I will probably be long dead by the time it is ready anyway!

The 07s were a disaster here and some importers gave up, even if it meant no future allocations as they did not want to get stuck with a load of overpriced Boredeaux from a not so great vintage, at a time when the 06s were also a hard sell and the top vintage 05s were being met with price resistance.

If 08 is not heavily discounted the Bordeaux producers and negociants are in for a tough time.

[DavidG]

It will be interesting to see where the buck literally stops with the '08s. If the chateaux sell through to the negociants, they wont be sitting on inventory. But what kinds of prices on '08s, or give-backs on '07s that are currently stuck in the pipeline, will the chateaux have to offer in order to sell the wines? Traditionally, the negociants and others further down the chain get stuck with the unsold wine. Perhaps this time, with a globally lousy economy and tight to non-existent credit, will be different?

[DavidG]

As to the '05s, I bought a fair amount as futures, though no firsts as they were just too costly. Most of the wines I bought are still priced for more than I paid, but it sounds like they are not selling. If they fall much further, it may turn out that it would have been wiser to wait than to buy them as futures. At least I didn't put the money into bank stocks or give it to Bernie Madoff.

[Blanquito]

I am seeing lots of 2005 Bordeaux being offerred at "blow-out" prices (to borrow a phrase from PJ's), even though these blow-out prices are still ~40% over what I paid for them as futures. The question is which retailers will blink first and start dumping at or below futures pricing. Until then, I doubt these '05s will move any time soon.

[PappaDoc]

And California is stuck with an ocean of wine they are unable to sell, A lot of the cult wines prices are tumbling. Wines will be sold at half price in many cases soon.

[Houndsong]

They will not taste as good at half price. Research conclusively establishes this. Plus they never taste as good to shmucks like me (who will probably buy a bottle or two) who don't get the whole lavish lifestyle thing to begin with.

[JimHow]

I swear Carruades tasted better when it was $25 a bottle.

[AlexR]

I saw 2005 Cheval Blanc at 790 euros at Carrefour (equivalent of Walmart or Costco) yesterday.

I thought it was an outrageous price.
Think of all the things you could do with that money!

However, I admit that passion is perhaps at that price for some, and I will not make a value judgement.

Best regards,
Alex R.

[DavidG]

Patrick, you probably jumped earlier than me and got better prices on the '05s. I'm seeing more like a 25-30% differential between my futures prices and the current market. Then again, is it even a "market" if nothing is selling?

Hound, all kidding aside it is true that research conclusively shows that the pricier wine tastes better to most people when they are aware of the price. I wish I could say I was immune to this bias, but I suspect I would be just as likely as the next guy to be influenced by the label in a non-blind tasting. But to take this into full naval-gazing mode: if I enjoy something more for the "wrong" reasons (because it costs more or is from a favorite producer), rather than the "right" reasons (because it actually tastes better blind), is that enjoyment any less valuable to me? Not until/unless I am forced to confront the paradox by doing a blind comparison.

[stefan]

>>
I saw 2005 Cheval Blanc at 790 euros at Carrefour.
Think of all the things you could do with that money!
>>

Like a case of an outstanding wine. Or (almost) three outstanding dinners for two at BWE-DC.

stefan

[PaulF]

NH doesn't readily lower prices on most items due to the aforementioned low markup. These puppies are going to be living on the store shelves for a long time to come. The market changed and they're going to have to take a loss on these if they're going to move them. State governments don't like to do that. The bad news is that summer is coming and I hate to think what's still sitting in their warehouses.

[JimHow]

You're right, Paul. They price them low and they leave them at that price, except for their annual one-month French wine and gift card sales. They've had a dozen bottles of 2005 Mongeard-Mugneret Richebourg sitting on the shelves in Nashua at $291 per bottle for a year now, they haven't sold a single bottle. I feel sorry for NH because their pricing has always been honorable, but there's definitely a side of me that is glad these wines didn't sell, like everything else in the global economy I think there is going to be some bitter medicine necessary before things get better.

[PaulF]

Jim, I agree and it's hard to fault NH on this. So many experts were touting the 2005 vintage. If they hadn't brought in the big guns we as consumers would have complained. But now they're stuck with a lot of overpriced wine that no one can afford.

I'm actually hoping this doesn't affect them too much because I'd hate to see them cut back on the luxury wines at a time when the prices for newer vintages should be more reasonable.

[JimHow]

Yeah, i notice they have the usual large offerings of Jadot from the 2006 vintage, but I'm seeing much fewer offerings, at least so far, of the other Burgundy wines they typically offer. Hopefully those are coming and, like you say, hopefully they don't become gun-shy as a result of getting burned from the 2005 French wine vintage. There are still a lot of 2005 Chateauneuf du Papes like Beaucastel at $96 per bottle, etc., still sitting on the shelves.

[PaulF]

I saw the 2005 Phelps Insignia there for $160 last weekend. That actually isn't a bad price these days. I used to have to beg them to hold bottles for me when it was going for $90-$100 just a few short years ago.

To their credit I still see a lot of new stuff hitting their shelves but less and less of it appears to be coming from France. I really wish they'd go deep on 2007 Chateauneuf but I doubt they will.

[JimHow]

Paul, I ran into a large collection of 2006 Burgundy at the Portsmouth store today, all the same properties they had in stock from the 2005 vintage, the prices seem to be about the same as the '05s. I bought a few bottles of 2006 d'Angerville Premier Cru and 2006 d'Aangerville Premier Cru Champans. Can anyone tell me what Burghound rates these wines?

[Chasse-Spleen]

I love this thread although it is really sad in a way. But one thing that I'm curious about is why is La Mission HB more than twice as expensive as LLC? I checked with WA and LLC is actually a point higher at 98. I figured, guessing, that LMHB would have had to be a 100 pt wine to go to such a crazy price. But then I looked them up. Maybe the production is much lower for LMHB? Usually, it's cheaper than LLC. I actually bought a bottle of the '99 a couple of years ago for $55. Those were the days.

[JimHow]

It was that $899 price for the LMHB, Chasse, that actually caught my eye, then I realized the high priced wines of LLC, Ducru, Pavie, Latour, etc., were sitting right there next to it. I was wrong about the price of Pavie, it is $500, not $400.