Wine Loving Inventor Solves Red or White By Glass Battle

[jal]

http://bloom.bg/16F3aLo

I may even try it

[stefan]

It sounds great, not that Lucie has trouble finishing anything good that I open.

[jal]

It sounds like it will work great with younger wines, I wonder what happens to the older bottles. Do they stop aging/evolvinng because whatever little air was in the bottle was now replaced by gas?

[jal]

It sounds like it will work great with younger wines, I wonder what happens to the older bottles. Do they stop aging/evolving because whatever little air was in the bottle is now replaced by gas?

[DavidG]

The air in the bottle is not replaced by argon. The wine in the bottle is replaced by argon. The air remains and mixes with the argon, so there will be a little higher air/liquid ratio as the bottle is consumed.

I bought one of these gadgets, mostly because my weakness for wine-related gadgets tends to overpower my common sense. Parker posted a video of a tasting of some bottles that had been initially "Coravin-d" many months and even a couple of years earlier and claimed that they tasted as fresh as he would expect newly opened bottles to taste. No control group though. I plan on doing an experiment with 2003 Pontet Canet over a few years. Other than ITNOS, I think I'll use it only occasionally for valuable bottles that I anticipate consuming over a week or two. Most bottles get consumed in a day or two and wont need the device.

[jal]

Aaah, interesting.

Thanks, David

[dstgolf]

David,

This thing looks and sounds great. As we age more and more bottles are lasting 2-3 days with some going off before being finished.

Argon refills are they readily available and how many bottles does one canister do? I looked online and the Coravin seems only available through the company at $299 with argon refills $11 a pop. Any other sources cheaper. Looks like a good Xmass/Bday gift!!

[dstgolf]

Second thought.

What stops you from sucking your first growths dry and refilling the bottle with cheap whatever and putting up for sale. Capsule and cork intact. Great business in the making!!

[DavidG]

I think they said something like 15 glasses per agon capsule, but I suppose it depends on the size of the glass. I cant say definitively because while i got the gizmo, a mix-up resulted in the argon capsules just being shipped today. I'm guessing I'll use it for 2-3 glasses on a given bottle, then just pop the cork later on down the line to finish it.

Sediment may be an issue. They suggest leaving the bottle horizontal, same as it was stored, while using the device on older bottles with sediment.

Counterfeiting isn't something I worry about since I don't buy expensive stuff on the secondary market, but that's an interesting perspective. I guess it's posible to replace the wine in a bottle with a needle and syringe without a Coravin.

[Tom In DC]

So if you leave the bottle horizontal, you're definitely only using the C'Vin for the first 50-60% of the bottle, eh? I'll bet it makes a mess if you blow past the wine level at the end of the needle!

I've heard it punches a noticeable hole in the capsule (and maybe leaves a bit of a scar on the cork?). But I've also seen a fan suggest that the auction houses might use this to verify the wines which seems like a giant black hole if they ever start doing so.

"Oh, that Coravin hole? That was made by the auction house. Here, let me show you the note in the catalog," said Rudy.

[DavidG]

Well, that's what they say. But yes, I think it would only be good for the first half of the bottle. Unless you tip it very gently neck down. I figure I'll just take the cork out when I get to the second half of the bottle.

A few people have posted about the pressure blowing wine around the cork in older bottles. Apparently just a few quick presses of the lever are needed for the first glass or pressure can build up too high. Mine arrived but they forgot to send the argon capsules, so it'll be a few days before I can actually play with it. I'm guessing it'll probably sit with most of the other kitchen gadgets that get used a bunch when new, then rarely after that. But I couldn't resist my gadget-philia. Will post a report when I try it.

[DavidG]

So the argon capsules show up and I try this thing. Works like a charm. Second "pour" of a Bryant Cab a week after the first is indistinguishable, at least by memory. But...

(Warning, you may not want to try this at home)

I proudly demonstrate my shiny new toy for my wife, who says, "That's really unappealing. The nice sound and look of the wine pouring into the glass is gone. It's so slow, like an old guy having trouble peeing."

Shrinkage, anyone?

[dstgolf]

Sounds like not enough argon pressure inside or sediment blocking needle?? Doesn't sound like a great investment.Maybe a little blue pill may help get the flow speed up!

[DavidG]

It's just the way the device works. The needle has to be pretty skinny to let the cork re-seal. And unless you keep pressing the trigger, which wastes the gas, the argon pressure at the end of the pour, umm, peters out.

[tim]

Sorry to resurrect an old thread, but what are people's opinions of Coravin? I just bought mine (it hadn't really been available in France until recently, largely due to the shipping of gas containers). Tonight was the first time I've used it. What worries me the most is the older corks which are more fragile and might cave in while poking the little needle in. But nonetheless, poured myself a glass of sauternes, which to me is the perfect reason to have a Coravin, as I rarely if ever drink more than a glass in one evening.

What are other BWE'ers experience with Coravin? If you have one, when do you use it? I'd be curious to know...

(FWIW, the Sauternes was a 1990 Chateau d'Arche, beautiful albeit a bit more evolved than some of the more high-end 1990's).

[DavidG]

Have one, haven't used it in ages.

[jal]

I got one last week and used it a few times.
Here are my impressions:
Great for Sauternes or other dessert wines as you said.
Great for young but ready to drink wines like Beaujolais or easy Brunello or anything Jim likes from the right bank
My problem is with wines that need to be open a while to show their quality. A shut 2006 Lagrange and a 2011 Barolo Vilero from Fenocchio with VA were only drinkable after opening the bottles and letting them breathe for a few hours up to a day. In those instances, the Coravin just transferred a not-ready wine to the glass.
I think older wines would probably be fine, I understand there's a new thinner needle made especially for older corks. https://www.coravin.com/wine-accessorie ... eedle.html
Good luck

[dstgolf]

Tim,

I was going to get one but after Davids disappointment and a visit to my buddies in Florida who got one I changed my mind. When I tried it down there it just took too long to get a glass of wine from the bottle and forget about trying for the second glass it was an eternity. I don't think Claude has used it since sadly. Maybe they've changed the design but....

I have tried and had good success with a product called wine preserver. They are canisters of argon gas with a long plastic nozzle attachment that can reach deep into an open bottle. A little spritz and they argon being heavier than room air will float on top of the wine keeping the oxygen away from contacting the wine as long as the bottle is left standing. Not as effective in storing long term as the Coravin because there is more oxygenation when pouring a glass or two before putting the gas in. It keeps the wine pretty fresh for at least a week which is certainly better than these vacuum pumps. A good option and not that expensive on Amazon.

[tim]

Thanks Danny, I have a bunch of bottles of the wine preserver, I use it occasionally but that forces me to open the bottle, of course.

The idea that I like about the coravin is that I can pour small pours from a couple of interesting bottles during an evening with a visitor without feeling compelled to finishing the bottles that night or even that week. We'll see, for now I've only tried with the Sauternes and I'd like to see how it matures post-Coravin...

[DavidG]

Tim, the Coravin would be useful for that purpose. However, a few limitations:

I wouldn't keep a bottle over a month. I've had a few go OTH after a month, even without an obvious cork leak. I don't trust it long term. I don't have the skinny needle but I'll tell you, even the normal needle produces a slow and less-than-elegant pour suggesting the need for a prostatectomy.

Won't work with Champagne or other sparklers, even if you remove the metal cap and replace the cage. You'll get a glass full of foam and a bottle of still wine with the first pour.

Not an acceptable option for wines with significant sediment.

It's like a pop and pour each time. You miss the opportunity to see the wine develop with air.

Those limitations plus the infrequency with which I want/need to save a bottle are why mine has been unused for over a year.

One final thought: are the proprietary argon capsules available in Paris?

[tim]

David, yes, the capsules are available in Paris. I waited until they were. I don't see using this for Champagne, as the CO2 in sparkling wine seems to help protect against oxidation, even if the sparkles go away a little. But I wouldn't ever hold a Champagne open for more than a couple of days, that would be sacrilegious.

[Blanquito]

Everything that David said. Fragile, old wines are not an option for my coravin as even some younger wines have shown signs of change after a few days that I don't like. It is handy if you just want a glass or two of a weekday sipper, that's about it.

[DavidG]

Tim, if there were an easy way to get it to you, I would be happy to give you mine.

...

Tom in DC is coming over for dinner tonight, and it looks like you will both be at the BWE convention in California. If he's willing to schlep it and you're willing to wait until March, I'll send it home with him.

[AKR]

There's some crazy guy on WB who must work in a specialty machine shop or something. He basically built some way to plug his Coravin into an industrial argon bottle. He sells the adaptor too. I don't have the link but it should be pretty easy to find - it's an extremely long thread.
==========
Best wine gadget I've gotten in a few years is one of those German Monopol extractors. Use it all the time now, even on young wines. Also as campy as it is, love my little dedicated wine temperature dipper. Too much stuff was getting consumed when it was too cold upon pouring, and this makes it easy to make to figure out how long to wait.

[tim]

David, no worries, I already bought one, was more looking for tips as to how and when to use it.

[tim]

Coravin test on older wine, 1959 Leoville Poyferre: FAIL.

The pressure from the gas ended up blowing the wine through the edges of the cork. It forced me to open the bottle.

The wine itself was an elegant although not stellar example of and aged bordeaux. The color is amazing, deep red with slight bricking. The nose was a muted mixture of leather, meat, cedar, etc. Fully integrated tannins, it felt like it wanted to say something amazing in the mouth but then only whispered. I am curious how this would stack up against other 59's. 89 pts.