Shipping

Post Reply
User avatar
AKR
Posts: 5234
Joined: Thu Mar 19, 2015 4:33 am
Contact:

Shipping

Post by AKR »

I know some of you are watching this gathering storm, or have already been lashed by its wind & rains, but it seems like things are getting worse, even for those who might have thought they were unaffected by living in a shipping friendly state

http://www.wineberserkers.com/forum/vie ... 1&t=134697

Those who are either buying futures or using 'hold til ship' options, might want to reconsider the risk / reward if this continues to deteriorate.

It's strange to me -- the normal trend for societies over long periods of time is for the laws to reflect the social mores of the populations. America likes to drink, and likes free commerce, so over time blue laws, interstate shipping, Winery Direct to Consumer etc. all became less stringent over the decades. For me, the only real backwards move was the post 9/11 putative move to ban liquids like wine from the passenger cabin when flying.

Anyways keep an eye on this issue, and if one is purchasing out of state, or buying en primeur, give some thought to this issue and what can happen if the rules change in between purchase date and ship date.
User avatar
AKR
Posts: 5234
Joined: Thu Mar 19, 2015 4:33 am
Contact:

Re: Shipping

Post by AKR »

Developments seem to have gotten worse, even for CA residents.

WBers are reporting this morning that some NY retailers are refusing to ship into CA.

I don't know the full story, nor have I experienced the problem myself.

Yet if that is really true, that's a sea change.

Observing all the troubles over recent years with purchasing remotely, I've mostly been making efforts to get stuff out of state shipped, and put a pause on any 'hold til shipped' ideas.

Most of us have enough swill anyways that we can survive many years til this situation is clarified.
User avatar
DavidG
Posts: 8280
Joined: Sat Nov 22, 2008 1:12 pm
Location: Maryland
Contact:

Re: Shipping

Post by DavidG »

I'm lucky that I'm past the acquisition phase. Fortunately I have very little outstanding with retailers who would have to ship to me. Four bottles in CA and one in NY. I'll be disappointed if I have to take refunds but it's not a big deal.

But on a larger scale this could be a significant inconvenience for consumers and a major drag on the wine retailing business. I wonder what percent of interstate wine sales are people who are saving a few bucks on something readily available locally vs. those buying less widely distributed wines. Sales of the latter may just go away.

And then there's the issue of the Commerce Clause and the Supreme Court decision in Granholm. Granholm applies narrowly to winery sales, but shouldn't the same principle apply if a retailer brought suit? Would the lost business come back after the years of delay waiting for a case to work its way through the system?
User avatar
JimHow
Posts: 20106
Joined: Thu Nov 20, 2008 10:49 pm
Location: Lewiston, Maine, United States
Contact:

Re: Shipping

Post by JimHow »

Zachy's won't ship my two Dal Fornos to Maine, I'm gonna pick them up next week.
I have an order shipping from MacArthur's on Monday by UPS, we'll see if I have any problems.
User avatar
Blanquito
Posts: 5923
Joined: Mon Jan 26, 2009 9:24 pm

Re: Shipping

Post by Blanquito »

This would be a shame in general if it goes nationwide, but on a personal level there would be a substantial silver lining to a shipping cessation. It would make selling one's wine much harder though.
User avatar
AKR
Posts: 5234
Joined: Thu Mar 19, 2015 4:33 am
Contact:

Re: Shipping

Post by AKR »

http://www.wineberserkers.com/forum/vie ... 1&t=142933

Seems like the forces of darkness are getting agents to do their dirty work.

I really curtailed out of state purchases in fear of this, but still do have some items outside CA, which need to be dealt with in the fall.
User avatar
JCNorthway
Posts: 1546
Joined: Mon Jan 26, 2009 9:31 pm
Contact:

Re: Shipping

Post by JCNorthway »

I've dealt with the Illinois obstacle for the past several years. Having just recently moved to Michigan, I was hoping I had left that headache behind. Sadly, it sounds like that is not the case. To complicate matters, wine options in Chicago were far superior to what I'm finding in the metro Detroit area.
User avatar
Jay Winton
Posts: 1836
Joined: Mon Jan 26, 2009 9:06 pm
Location: Rehoboth Beach, DE USA
Contact:

Re: Shipping

Post by Jay Winton »

I thinking checking with your local delivery folks is a good way to see which way the wind is blowing locally. If you can get a gun shipped to you, why not wine?????
User avatar
AKR
Posts: 5234
Joined: Thu Mar 19, 2015 4:33 am
Contact:

Re: Shipping

Post by AKR »

Jay - you keep repeating this bullshit about guns being easy to ship.

They're not. I've had lots shipped. It's a major PITA with lots of regulations.

And that's just as a normal citizen. (It's even more complicated for those in the trade)

I'd too would like wine to be easy to be ship, with consistent rules across jurisdictions, but repeatedly bringing up firearms shipping - and not understanding that shipping/transporting those is nationally regulated - doesn't help the discussion.
User avatar
Jay Winton
Posts: 1836
Joined: Mon Jan 26, 2009 9:06 pm
Location: Rehoboth Beach, DE USA
Contact:

Re: Shipping

Post by Jay Winton »

The manager at my local Fedex in MD (not particularly gun friendly) told me they had no problem shipping a gun as long as I removed the ammo. Ok, I might have to fill out a few forms. Wine no way, so no BS Arvind.
User avatar
AKR
Posts: 5234
Joined: Thu Mar 19, 2015 4:33 am
Contact:

Re: Shipping

Post by AKR »

AKR wrote:Jay - you keep repeating this bullshit about guns being easy to ship.

They're not. I've had lots shipped. It's a major PITA with lots of regulations.

And that's just as a normal citizen. (It's even more complicated for those in the trade)

I'd too would like wine to be easy to be ship, with consistent rules across jurisdictions, but repeatedly bringing up firearms shipping - and not understanding that shipping/transporting those is nationally regulated - doesn't help the discussion.
Jay Winton wrote:The manager at my local Fedex in MD (not particularly gun friendly) told me they had no problem shipping a gun as long as I removed the ammo. Ok, I might have to fill out a few forms. Wine no way, so no BS Arvind.
Again, you haven't shipped one. You are glossing over the 'few forms' and what that really entails.

You keep bringing this up in every wine shipping thread and it makes you look stupid.
User avatar
DavidG
Posts: 8280
Joined: Sat Nov 22, 2008 1:12 pm
Location: Maryland
Contact:

Re: Shipping

Post by DavidG »

JCNorthway wrote:I've dealt with the Illinois obstacle for the past several years. Having just recently moved to Michigan, I was hoping I had left that headache behind. Sadly, it sounds like that is not the case. To complicate matters, wine options in Chicago were far superior to what I'm finding in the metro Detroit area.
Where in metro Detroit Jon? I grew up there in the '60s. Speaking of which, saw the movie Detroit last night. Very powerful stuff.
User avatar
JimHow
Posts: 20106
Joined: Thu Nov 20, 2008 10:49 pm
Location: Lewiston, Maine, United States
Contact:

Re: Shipping

Post by JimHow »

Wow that's quite a move Jon, how do you like it.
User avatar
JCNorthway
Posts: 1546
Joined: Mon Jan 26, 2009 9:31 pm
Contact:

Re: Shipping

Post by JCNorthway »

David, we are downtown along the Detroit Riverwalk in the the Rivertown Warehouse area (used to be Stroh's location, and before that, Parke Davis pharma). We are in a loft building (renting) that sits about 150 feet from the river, and right next door to the Rattlesnake Club, if you know where that is. Where did you live around here?

Jim, yes, it was a big move. But we were ready to sell our house in Chicago, and did not feel a need to remain there. Paula's mother is in the Detroit metro area and getting up in years. So we thought this would be a nice opportunity to spend some time with her while we can. Paula also has two siblings with their own families in the area. We don't necessarily think we are here for the long-term. We have not yet figured out where we think that will be.

We are having a lot of fun so far, exploring the area and checking out the scene. Because of what has happened in the city over the last few decades (culminating with the bankruptcy), it has become an inviting place for entrepreneurs to start up their little businesses. Things that could not succeed with the costs associated with other cities can exist profitably here - at least for now.

Just this afternoon, we walked into a small business, a block from our place, called the Detroit Denim Company. They make blue jeans out of American denim and all other materials are American. They employ fewer than 10 people, but they got a nice article written about them in Afar magazine a few months back. And just last week, a local coffee roasting company opened up a 2nd location a block or so from us. It will be a nice addition for those living around here.

I'm sure that the redevelopment will take its toll on many of these businesses over time. One benefit for now is that there are a decent number of interesting dining places that seem to be thriving in the downtown, midtown, and nearby neighborhood areas. And we are enjoying trying out new places.

The wine scene is not particularly well developed here. To wit, I have not been able to find a good place to store wine here offsite in temp/humidity controlled space. I found one location with just a few lockers - the largest holding about 35 cases. And I have about 100 cases sitting in Chicago, looking for a nice place to stay here in the area. I also have not found any really good wine shops here yet. However, I'm still in research mode on that. And for BWE type folks, Michigan is not a BYO friendly place.
User avatar
DavidG
Posts: 8280
Joined: Sat Nov 22, 2008 1:12 pm
Location: Maryland
Contact:

Re: Shipping

Post by DavidG »

Jon, my father was an executive with Parke-Davis until the '70s and worked downtown. I visited his office a few times. Went downtown riverside on July 4 to watch the fireworks a few times. We lived at 8 mile and Livernois, moved to the suburbs in 1965.

I've never been to the Rattlesnake Club but have heard good things. There is an annual several-day wine gathering organized through Robin Garr's Wine Lovers Page. It's held in the summer around Ann Arbor and is called the Motor City Co-operative Offline (MOCOOL). They've been doing it for ~25 years. This would be a good place to connect with the local wine scene. The next one is coming up in a week or two. Info is at http://mocool.org.
Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot], Google [Bot] and 19 guests