Clos Fourtet

[Comte Flaneur]

I have wine physically stored in various places and pretty much all of it is also stored inside my head.

I am always fretting over when to release wines from storage especially as I have limited storage at home, taking wine out usually means taking a whole case out and I am already beyond 100% capacity utilisation.

So part of the process involves monitoring the progress of wines here, elsewhere and especially on Cellar Tracker.

I bought a case of 2000 Clos Fourtet on release, and when I looked at CT recently several posters opined that this wine is now over the hill. I was quite surprised to read that. I don’t necessarily believe it but it has got me thinking. At the very least the 2000 CF has jumped the queue and assuming I don’t sell it I will probably release it in the early fall.

I would not be surprised if this fairly hi falutin’ 2000 St Emilion was now well into its drinking window, but the notion that it might already be in decline I find quite shocking. Especially after trying so many vibrant 1989s in Denver.

Any thoughts? And has anyone tried this particular wine or Clos Fourtet in other vintages? It is not a wine that comes up frequently in dispatches.

I do understand it is fashioned in quite a ripe modern style. Could this be an example of a modern St-E falling apart? From what I gather the Big Bold Pavies are if anything ageing quite well, though the only one I have had recently is the 2003, which was surprisingly good, mellow and resolved.

[Nicklasss]

Hi Comte.

This is what i wrote at the summer 2015 :

00 Clos Fourtet: still dark red, nose of tobacco, prunes, rasberries, oak vanilla, dark red berries. In mouth, big, ripe, seductive, lost of creamy dark berries, ripe tannins, light chocolate. Thick with a long finish. An exçellent wine, with 10 more years to go. Tn: 90-91+.

The +10 years at that time seemed to me like a maximum, in my slighter warmer wine storage. At that time, i remember being already complex and excellent. Maybe i would recommend to don't lose too much time and drink slowly to 2025.


Nic

[Comte Flaneur]

Thanks Nic, very helpful, and puts my mind at ease. I know you are quite a conservative scorer so seems like you thought it was good but not a life changing experience?

[JimHow]

I recall really enjoying the 2006 Clos Fourtet, so much so that I bought another bottle which I've had sitting down in the cellar.
I don't recall anything about its ageworthiness.

[stefan]

I have drunk 7 bottles from my case of 1998 Clos Fourtet but am in no rush to finish the case. It has been stored at 64F since release. My guess is that your 2000 stored at 55F is at the beginning of its "plateau of maturity".

[Blanquito]

You’ll have to take one for the team, Ian, and let us know. But I’d also be very surprised if this was already over the hill, especially if the source is CT.

[jckba]

Been eyeing this unopened case of the 2005 in the cellar for a while now, so after reading Ian’s open ended question (re: aging of the 2000) I decided to pop one. The 2005 is 14.5% and it’s still pretty primary at this stage; ripe, extracted and still tightly wound but it did have a mineral tinged finish. Will cross my fingers and wait another 5 years but who really knows how these modern Saint-Emilion’s will age; certainement pas moi.

What’s the alcohol on the 2000 out of curiosity?

[AKR]

I'm guessing the 2000 is similar to the 1998, which we had a couple of years ago. Our notes were

http://www.bordeauxwineenthusiasts.com/ ... f=4&t=7184

The issue with CT notes is that its difficult to understand what background the people might have, and what their biases are.

At least here, you know everyone's preferences/palates.

My feel is that they should be enjoyed now though.

I would observe that at some point there was change in the style, whenever the Cuvelier's took over. I think 2000 and earlier were under regime ancien.

[DavidG]

I didn’t start buying Clos Fourtet until our BWE visit in 2005, so no personal experience with the 2000.

But when I look at the CT notes from palates I trust (TNs of people I’m a "fan" of float to the top), there are no suggestions that it’s OTH. On the contrary, they are saying it has recently entered or is in its prime drinking window. Based on that I’d be inclined to start drinking them now, but I wouldn’t be concerned about getting them drunk up this year.

[dstgolf]

Ian,

I had 6 98s and 6 2000s bought on futures with 2 of each left. Not to my taste being too modern and toasted oak very present. Last of each opened last year and still a long way from peaking. Not sure if they'll ever really integrate the big fruit/oak and still very present tannins. Whoever says these are beyond prime is either storing them in a warm cellar or likes their wines JimH young chewing through tannins. These are still very primary and they are 21 and 19 years old respectively. I thought they would be much better than they've shown to date for the ratings early on and I'd give the edge to the 98 but not saying that either are great.A little too new world for me and typical of what is going on in a bad way in St Emillion in my mind. I don't think either has shown their peak yet but I don't think they will ever be a great wine. 6 bottles of each has been more than enough for me and a little disappointing at that. To have a situation of bringing a case of the 2000 home and having to go through 12 over the next few years I'd suggest holding off and fingers crossed that this is still on the upside with hopeful integration in the future at least 5 years from first pop or selling with the thought that this is currently not and low probability of ever being great especially against traditional styled Bordeaux which is certainly more to my liking.
.

[Comte Flaneur]

Thank you very much all of you for your helpful comments, certainly puts my mind at ease. No need to rush to take this out, but I probably will after the summer. JC I can’t find the ABV on the 2000. As Danny notes may not be in everyone’s wheelhouse, but I look forward to trying it in the fall. I have enjoyed this wine from the 1985, 1986, 1995 and 1996 vintages but from what understand it took a modern turn at some point.

[Comte Flaneur]

I opened up a new storage at a facility called Big Yellow in Fulham southwest London about seven miles from my house in Islington. I can go there virtually any time to pick up wines, some of which I recently transferred from my long term storage - the vast majority of which is claret from vintages mainly spanning 1995 to 2004. Over 20 OWCs, one of which was the Clos Fourtet which claims to be 13% ABV.

The first bottle I opened from this newly liberated stash was Calon Segur 1995 which was the most woefully corked wine I have ever had the misfortune to open. Bad start but that wine is my nemesis. I never had a good bottle of it.

So then I reached for the first bottle of Clos Fourtet 2000 and it was excellent. This first bottle is well into its drinking window...I would guess at least five years in...it is modern without being spoofy. It has ripe red and cool blue fruits, minerals and St-E earthiness, a seamless plush palate and refined personality. The tannins are receding and I suspect that this is at its apogee as, compared to other 2000s I have tried,it is lowish in acidity. It has some grip but you would not describe this as being strict, tense, or having nervosity. It is a satisfying bottle which is polished and classy but at the same time recognisably St-Emilion. This should provide great drinking pleasure over the next five years but I would not be surprised if it starts to peel away in ten years. Unlike other 2000s I don’t think this will make old bones. With the benefit of hindsight I should have cracked into this case five years ago but this wine is in a very good place. I need to drink two a year rather than one a year going forward.

[Comte Flaneur]

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[JimHow]

This wine needed a negative blanquitoing.
I have one bottle of the 2006, which I enjoyed upon release.

[Blanquito]

We have:
Howing = drinking a wine young
and:
Blanquitoing = drinking a wine old

It seems like we need to define this too:
Howquitoing OR Blanqhowing = drinking a wine at peak

[JimHow]

I like it!
The quest for perfect maturity.

[jckba]

I like it!
The quest for perfect maturity.

And in the eyes of the beholder!

[stefan]

>>
The quest for perfect maturity.
>>

Indeed. The 2002 that, for my taste, was the best 2002 at a young age was Pape Clement. Wonderfully fruity, mouth filling, and strong tannins that supported the fruit. Now the fruit has receded quite a bit and the tannins seem harsher. It is still a fine wine, but I need to Blanquito it once or twice to get it to a better phase. I (almost) regret not drinking more bottles when the wine was precocious.

[JimHow]

JimHow wrote:
I like it!
The quest for perfect maturity.


And in the eyes of the beholder!

Au contraire, jckba!

The "Howquito" is that mystical place -- that Valhalla -- where all subjectivity is removed, that place of perfect maturity, of wine nirvana....

[Blanquito]

That’s exactly right, BD. When the likes of you and I fully agree a wine is in a great place, the earth stops spinning for a minute, the heavens open, and a wine sublime is attained.

[DavidG]

At first I thought a Howquito was a new species of super-mosquito. But careful research using the CERN Large Hadron Collider has determined the precise number of years post vintage it takes for a wine to reach the Howquito singularity:

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