Bordeaux Wine Enthusiasts

I have a sealed case of this in my cellar. And boy am I glad I do!
I brought a single bottle to my brother Tom's 60th birthday bash last night.
There were like a hundred people there but i got a couple glasses of this.
Wow, what a beauty! It had everything we look for in great Sociandos, and more.
Tremendous concentration but not over the top. Inky black color.
A classic Sociando nose to die for, from the moment of uncorking.
This wine is a beast, in the mold of like those old 1980s Gruauds from like '82 and '86.
It will age for a long time.
Loved this wine! When the summer gift card sale comes in NH I might invest in more bottles of this as part of the second mixed case of my exemption.
Rating: 95 points.

I also uncorked a 3 liter of 2010 Ciacci Piccolomini d'Aragona Brunello di Montalcino Vigna di Pianrosso as well, man was that baby singing!

Wow, super cool. I bought quite a bit but have not taken delivery yet. I barely bought any 2016s given my ripe old age of 54, but will not pass on Sociando.

BWE WOTY?

This is an Orlando Bobby kind of wine.
I think it is brilliant.

I agree with jim, this is a great SM.... but it’s also easily the ripest young SM I’ve ever tried. Sexy even. These aren’t bad things. It will settled down I’m sure but I plan to give my 6 bottles a good sleep.

OBobby, you should try a bottle and let us know your thoughts!

I was thinking of you while I was sipping it Patrick, I recalled your comments.
It is indeed big and ripe but I think with two or three or four blanquitoes it is going to be immense.
Great complexity, like those old Gruauds.

Jim.
You had the chance to vote SM 2016 as BWE WOTY.....as i sugested.
Gone.

I will grab a bottle... $42 local, if there are any left

Ugh. Now I am torn. Lusting for this.

But do I really need more S-M in the cellar?

Plenty of other vintages to scratch that itch when needed.

Yet, will they be the same as the 2016?

One can never have enough S&M

The 2016 sociando is almost as good as the Tour Saint Christophe, Ognik.
Psychologically it is tough to pick another Sociando as WOTY, as the '96 Sociando was our very first WOTY back in 2000.

We'll have fun for a long time with these 2016. I expect the best from Sociando, like every vintage.

The Patriots are dead. Bad vintage for the Patriots. Brady's like a Saint Émilion: you're in for sometimes, and now, you're out of classification. We'll have a fun time now with the NFL playoff.

Nic

In football as in life, Nicola, we can’t win every year.

I'm a bit mean Jim, but I like football. The Patriots did the playoff with their worst team in the last 10 years. This is still an achievement. I respect that.

Don't worry, look the destruction of my Vikings tomorrow...

Nic

Here's what's interesting. Sociando is only trading 30% more than what we paid in 1999-2000 for the 1996...That is very fair pricing given 20 years of built in inflation...Even at 3% compounded per year, the wine costs less in terms of purchasing power today than it did 20 years ago. I'm with Jim....may have to take a summer trip to NH to get me some

Agreed. Shockingly so.

I’m still amazed that I was buying the most excellent 2014 vintage for $27 to $30 per depending on the source. Easily the buy of the vintage.

“The 2016 sociando is almost as good as the Tour Saint Christophe, Ognik.”

Nice one, well said!

“Psychologically it is tough to pick another Sociando as WOTY, as the '96 Sociando was our very first WOTY back in 2000.”

Good point, although I think that other shy and retiring wine Leoville Poyferre won it twice.

Is 2016 the greatest Sociando ever? For my money the best I have ever tried is the 2005. I have 12 of those puppies resting peacefully.

Boy I only had a couple glasses at a loud and packed party but I think the 2016 may be the best Sociando ever.
Its awesomeness was evident on both the nose and palate -- and to the eyes -- as soon as I uncorked it.
I'll have to get another bottle this summer and really examine it.

@ Comte
SM 16 supposed to be better than 05.

@ Comte and Jim
Buy more. Value you can't afford to miss.

Better than ‘82? Better than ‘90? Better than ‘95?

There have been some greats. I think 2010 will rank up there as well.

I honestly cannot recall whether I tried the 2005. More likely I just stuck them away like I did with all 2005s. This is a monolithic vintage.

Like many on this site, I’ve had heaps of SM through the years, probably more than any other estate except Ridge. I’ve had the 82, 86, 88, 89 and 90 multiple times in the last 5-10 years, especially the 82 and 90.

When it’s on, the 82 is my favorite SM. But I’ve had more off bottles than not.

The 90 is my next favorite and it never seems to under perform, and so in that way it’s better than the 82. I had a bottle this past fall that was the best one yet.

My next favorite is the 95, which I think is better than the 96 at least today. The 96 is just a bit behind the 95, and is a classic wine that is nearly ready for prime time enjoyment.

My next fav after those is the 03, which isn’t the colossus I thought it would be on release, but it is shaping up nicely.

Of the 00-02 trio, I like the 01 best, the 02 is very good too but I’m liking the 00 less with more time.

I own around a case of the 05, but I’ve not tried one yet. I’ve not tied any vintages since 2005 either (Neal Martin’s notes never inspired me to spring for the 09 or 10), until the 16.

Damn, sometimes I really hate you guys, lol. I just bought 6 bottles and now I may have to go back for another 6. For all you that have tried it, what do you guess the drinking window go be, another 10 years?

Blanquito wrote:Like many on this site, I’ve had heaps of SM through the years, probably more than any other estate except Ridge. I’ve had the 82, 86, 88, 89 and 90 multiple times in the last 5-10 years, especially the 82 and 90.

When it’s on, the 82 is my favorite SM. But I’ve had more off bottles than not.

The 90 is my next favorite and it never seems to under perform, and so in that way it’s better than the 82. I had a bottle this past fall that was the best one yet.

My next favorite is the 95, which I think is better than the 96 at least today. The 96 is just a bit behind the 95, and is a classic wine that is nearly ready for prime time enjoyment.

My next fav after those is the 03, which isn’t the colossus I thought it would be on release, but it is shaping up nicely.

Of the 00-02 trio, I like the 01 best, the 02 is very good too but I’m liking the 00 less with more time.

I own around a case of the 05, but I’ve not tried one yet. I’ve not tied any vintages since 2005 either (Neal Martin’s notes never inspired me to spring for the 09 or 10), until the 16.

Had I sat down to write this, it would have read almost exactly like this.

I cannot recall whether I posted a note here, but the 2001 Sociando Cuvee Jean Gautreau is hands-down the best Sociando that I have ever had. Like First Growth quality. Exceptional. I popped a 2009 recently and it was too oaky, hope that recedes with time.

Gerry, the 2016 is big so I don’t think I could ever call it “light on its feet,” but it’s like it is big but doesn’t come across as overwhelming or big. And it seems to have great complexity at even a young age. I would expect this wine to shut down and it will have a long plateau, from 10 to 50 years.

So is there a moratorium exemption for this? I should hope so, and frankly for all vintages of SM. It would be heartless otherwise given Jean Gautreau's recent demise.

AlohaArtakaHoundsong wrote:So is there a moratorium exemption for this? I should hope so, and frankly for all vintages of SM. It would be heartless otherwise given Jean Gautreau's recent demise.

LOL, how about a "moratorium exemption" for Bordeaux in general? Anything less would be uncivilized!

Blanquito, I would be curious as to your view on the 2016 SM. I was not incredibly impressed by it TBH. I liked it but the size of the wine made it seem like a more "typical" Bordeaux than Sociando usually is; a bigger fruitier wine is not what I seek out SM for, I feel like for that style of wine there are a lot of options.

marcs wrote:

AlohaArtakaHoundsong wrote:So is there a moratorium exemption for this? I should hope so, and frankly for all vintages of SM. It would be heartless otherwise given Jean Gautreau's recent demise.

LOL, how about a "moratorium exemption" for Bordeaux in general? Anything less would be uncivilized!

Blanquito, I would be curious as to your view on the 2016 SM. I was not incredibly impressed by it TBH. I liked it but the size of the wine made it seem like a more "typical" Bordeaux than Sociando usually is; a bigger fruitier wine is not what I seek out SM for, I feel like for that style of wine there are a lot of options.

I haven't pledged not to buy this year. I'm not bound by the moratorium. But this is not about me. I'm just thinking of others. Jean Gautreau's death is an extraordinary circumstance. I just hate to see others suffer needlessly. The 2016 only just hit the shelves. I'd hate to see anyone miss out.

Sociando-Mallet produces over 400,000 bottles a vintage! They are not going to sell out an entire vintage in a single year! (Winesearcher shows current retail availability in the U.S. for every single vintage of SM from 1995 on except for 1999)

My usual sources -- New Hampshire, Zachy's, and MacArthur's -- will be sold out of 2016 Sociando by the end of the year.
In fact, MacArthur's is sold out.
Nonetheless, I just don't see where a Sociando Exemption is available under December 2019 precedent and rulemaking.

I will bet anyone on this board a free bottle of 2016 Sociando Mallet that one year from now (January 9, 2021) the 2016 Sociando Mallet will still be available by shipping order from a U.S. retailer at a price that is within $10 a bottle of the current price. I will bet this despite the tariffs, that's how 100% confident I am.

(Your situation may be different if you live in a state where it isn't possible to ship wine -- I am not betting that it will be available from a retailer in your state, but that it will be available from a U.S. retailer who ships to any state where shipping is legal).

P.S. Looked up Jancis' review of this wine and it accorded well with my own impressions:

Very dark glowing crimson. Great graphite nose. Some rich meatiness. Very much pushed up the ripeness scale. Seems richer than I remember it but it's clearly very ambitious. Thick and sweet. Not really my style but it will over-deliver to those who are still looking for a wine from the 1990s! Drying end. SCORE 16.5

I don't understand Jancis' note at all. I have the advantage of not having tasted the 2016 but thick, sweet and very much pushed up the ripeness scale describes no Sociando Mallet I have ever had, young or old. And what is the ref to the 1990s? Is she referring to the decade or the vintage? I have never found her notes all that coherent.

The 2016 Sociando was for sure the biggest, ripest Sociando I have ever had. It was pretty un-Sociando like to me, although not a bad wine.

I like Jancis' notes because even though they are written in a somewhat random way I trust that they record honest impressions and she doesn't seem to have that impulse to praise everything to the high heavens that the other critics do.

Jancis' note on 2016 Sociando is pretty clear. I think you probably got her point too, Art, if your impression was that it "describes no Sociando Mallet I have ever had." "The 1990s" refers to the shift to riper, lower acid wines and the "Parkerization" that took hold in that decade. In contrast to the more recent shift away from those extremes. The note is consistent with Marcus'. Possibly consistent with Jim's note as well, as I’ve seen him go for both ripe-fruited and "crunchy"-fruited wines with equal enthusiasm, though I’d be interested to hear him compare 2016 Sociando to prior vintages.

I’ve had a lot of Sociando from the 1982 vintages up to the 2014 vintage. Other than 1990 and 2003, what vintage of Sociando would you all call “very ripe”? I’m curious. Funny that 2000, a solar vintage, and Sociando produced a wine that is actually “under-ripe”.

marcs wrote:The 2016 Sociando was for sure the biggest, ripest Sociando I have ever had. It was pretty un-Sociando like to me, although not a bad wine.

+1 (with the caveat that I’ve not tried the 09, 10 or 15).

marcs wrote:I like Jancis' notes because even though they are written in a somewhat random way I trust that they record honest impressions and she doesn't seem to have that impulse to praise everything to the high heavens that the other critics do.

+2.

I should have noted, I found the 2009 Sociando Mallet Cuvee Jean Gautreau very Napa-esque, ripe and with oak. Hope it settles down as I have a bunch. Still a baby. But, so unlike 2001, which is hands down the best Sociando that I have ever had, JG Cuvee or base domaine wine. The 1995 Sociando JG is stellar as well, and 1996 is damn fine, too.

2016 has everything we like in Sociando, but in a big way.
But I in no way felt it was overripe. I thought it was quintessential Sociando.
It's just big. Cedary, oak but not overbearing.
But... two small glasses while socializing at a large, loud party.
I gotta revisit this in 2020.

For the record, I did not find 2003 or 1990 over-ripe. Actually, other than that 2009 JG, i’ve Never found an over-ripe Sociando.

Looking forward to trying the 2016 myself.

I am optimistic about the 16 SM, but it is riper/sweeter/less tannic than the 03 was on release. I never found the 03 overripe, it’s biggest difference for me was the chewy, glycerin-infused midpalate. It probably has lower or softer tannin than most prior years too, but I recall it having more obvious structure than the 16.

These aren’t criticisms of the 16 - I still really like the wine — just differences. FWIW, the 16s in general seem remarkably elegant and approachable in tannin for a new bordeaux vintage (but without being flabby or overly soft), so this might be the vintage signature as much as anything.

I think the 2016 Sociando is very Bordeaux.
It is nothing like California.

JimHow wrote:I think the 2016 Sociando is very Bordeaux.
It is nothing like California.

Completely.