2020 BWE WOTY

Nicklasss · Post by **Nicklasss** » Sun Nov 22, 2020 5:55 pm

As 2020 has been a very unusual year, and to boost the discussion, agreements, dissidences, etc... i think about starting that thread right now.

BWEers opened less bottles i guess in 2020, because of all the confinements around the World, and less gatherings, did not gave us the chance to share great wines too often.

Also, i don't think 2017 has generated lot of enthusiast here on BWE, i can't even remember a significant post on a 2017 red Bordeaux...

The 2020 Bordeaux BWE convention trip would also have been a great opportunity to help selecting 2020 BWE WOTY, but the pandemic made it impossible sadly.

With all that, this is why we need more time to influence the BD choice, as it won't be easy this year.

So i open this long process with two candidates, that have been opened at the2020 Washington DC BWE convention, the 1986 Chateau Pichon Comtesse de Lalande and the 2000 Chateau Léoville Barton.

The 3 liters of 1986 Chateau Pichon Comtesse de Lalande made strong impression, being a strong vintage for that producer, that is finally drinking better than ever now. Also i guess that in the past, many BWEers had that wine and have always been positive about that wine. Last thing, i think Pichon Comtesse de Lalande never won the BWE WOTY, so is it due now?

The 2000 Chateau Léoville Barton was great also in Washington DC, even if just starting to get out of teenager age. It was my first time with that wine and i thought it was better than the 1996, a very strong classic Barton Saint Julien, with all the power, classicism, complexity, elegance and balanced lenght expected from that producer. I tasted it with two other very very strong 2000, the Lynch Bages and the Pichon Longueville Baron, and the Léoville Barton was conviniently performing as well. A blind tasting of these three 2000 that night, would have been an unforgettable event...

So i'm starting with these two candidates, and will come back with other(s) from more recent vintage.

Have fun.

Nic

P.S. i know we're probably doing all that for nothing, as the BD as ultimate good and justice leader, has probably already selected the winner. But let think like he did not...

DavidG · Post by **DavidG** » Sun Nov 22, 2020 7:04 pm

Thanks for starting us off Nic. Should we review past winners to avoid duplication?

Your comment about the amount we drank in 2020 is interesting. I drank more Bordeaux in 2020 than in any prior year other than in 2005, where the BWE Bordeaux trip pumped up the numbers considerably. If I discount the wines we had on that trip as being "tasted" rather than "drunk," 2020 reigns supreme. Partly due to the cellar maturing. Partly due to being retired. Partly due to being at home "in lockdown" with nothing better to do than open a bottle and enjoy a book or movie.

I'm so glad we had a chance to get together with our BWE brethren in DC just before things shut down. Can't wait to be able to travel without worry once again.

JoelD · Post by **JoelD** » Sun Nov 22, 2020 8:30 pm

Nic, I like the idea although sadly I have to disagree with the wines. Neither of those made my top 5 at the BWE dinner. Although I do believe I will like the 2000 LB more in 5+ years. I would also like to try the 86 Pichon out of a 750 or mag as I found that one slightly young, and possibility a little VA

My top wines at that event were(approximately in this order, but not precisely)
1990 Ausone
1990 Pichon Baron(although I have tried again since and did not enjoy the second bottle the same. no tannic structure on the second)
2000 Conseillante
2000 Lynch Bages
2005 Pichon Baron
1989 Pichon Baron
1990 Las Cases
1982 Las Cases
2000 Pichon Baron
1990 Figeac

The Barton and Pichon were both just outside the top 10. My Bordeaux palate is still constantly changing but I found the above wines to all be better just at that event. I'd be curious to hear your and David's thoughts/list from that event as well. I know we had a thread somewhere but I don't know if we delved in.

Blanquito · Post by **Blanquito** » Sun Nov 22, 2020 8:40 pm

A few of my top wines so far in 2020...

1964 C.V.N.E. Rioja Viña Real Reserva Especial
2016 Niellon Chassagne-Montrachet Chaumées Clos de la Truffière
2002 Piper-Heidsieck Champagne Cuvée Rare

I haven't pulled a lot of old, special bottles from my cellar, as we've mostly been drinking casually at home. I need to finish the last 6 weeks of the year in style.

JimHow · Post by **JimHow** » Sun Nov 22, 2020 8:55 pm

Nicola, are you talking about what is our favorite wine of the year, or are you talking about what should be the BWE wine of the year? Those are two different things.

Comte Flaneur · Post by **Comte Flaneur** » Sun Nov 22, 2020 9:01 pm

It would be nice for Leoville Barton to win for once.

I am prepared to second Nic’s suggestion of the 2000

s*d*r · Post by **s*d*r** » Sun Nov 22, 2020 9:11 pm

JimHow wrote:Nicola, are you talking about what is our favorite wine of the year, or are you talking about what should be the BWE wine of the year? Those are two different things.

Nic’s thread title suggests it should be the BWE WOTY, as per custom.

For the last few years, in December I have initiated a thread for Top 10 of the year, meaning the personal favorites for each of us. It’s too soon for that. I was also thinking it should be Top 5 instead this year for the reasons Nic mentioned.

Stu

As for BWE WOTY, one of those enjoyable 2016s should be strongly considered.

Nicklasss · Post by **Nicklasss** » Sun Nov 22, 2020 11:15 pm

JimHow wrote:Nicola, are you talking about what is our favorite wine of the year, or are you talking about what should be the BWE wine of the year? Those are two different things.

BWE wine of the year, like Stu pointed out. I'm trying to help my benevolent dictator and facilitate his view over all that, in his infinite wisdom.

And like JoelD wrote, the 1986 Pichon Lalande and 2000 Léoville Barton are among top wines I had this year, but sutely not my favorites. But as BWE WOTY, i think they are very interesting candidates.

Nic

JimHow · Post by **JimHow** » Sun Nov 22, 2020 11:37 pm

Yes but that is my point, shouldn’t the BWE wine of the year be more than a wine that a couple guys liked at one tasting in DC?

JimHow · Post by **JimHow** » Sun Nov 22, 2020 11:51 pm

We should be talking about the Criteria for selection of the BWE wine of the year.

The first rule is there are no set rules.
Jckba and others have suggested it should be from the most recent vintage to hit the shelves.
I think that's a good consideration but, as you pointed out above, there are going to be years, like 2017, that have not generated much excitement or discussion here.
I like the idea of giving heavy consideration to estates that have been putting together a track record of success.
Or maybe, to stir up the pot, an occasional "controversial" pick.
Or, yes, maybe a special wine that was tasted at a particular event, like 2000 Margaux or 1989 Lafite.
In the end, I think we've had a fun little system here, where people argue for their picks and I, in my kindness and benevolence, select -- some would say "dictate" -- the winner.
Usually I like to pick a wine that has some level of a buzz to it, that has generated interest and discussion here on the site.
When superb vintages like 2014/15/16 come around, the vintage is going to play a role in the decision.

marcs · Post by **marcs** » Mon Nov 23, 2020 12:24 am

Unfortunately I was so overwhelmed by the tidal wave of wine at BWE 2020 that I was somewhat unable to pick out which wines were best. Many were good, I remember that much!

The best wine I had this year was probably the 2009 Chevillon Vaucrains, but of course that is not a BWE wine of the year.

But for BWE wine of the year, might I suggest 2004 Leoville Barton?

That wine would be a victory for undersung "off vintages", for drinking wines when they are mature (sorry Jim), and for Leoville Barton. It has also generated a lot of discussion on the site this year, with Ian, myself, and I think some others praising it to the skies. It is available at very reasonable prices still (well under $100 if you look). I personally have had it twice this year and it was fantastic both times. Frankly, I prefer it to the 2000 at least for now, though that may be partially due to maturity.

The point of Bordeaux is not the hot new vintage. It is sitting and waiting with humble and undersung vintages and humble and undersung wines until they blossom into a gorgeous experience sometime between 15 and 25 years old. For me, the 2004 Leoville Barton epitomized that this year.

Blanquito · Post by **Blanquito** » Mon Nov 23, 2020 1:03 am

I believe our very own Robert Goulet would heartedly endorse a winner from 2004.

Nicklasss · Post by **Nicklasss** » Mon Nov 23, 2020 1:48 am

2004 Chateau Léoville Barton is surely a good candidate too. What about the 2008 Léoville Barton? Clearly in line with 2004, another unsung vintage, but in 2008, Léo Barton also made a classical and fully rewarding Saint Julien.

If you like a little bit of controversy, the 2003 Chateau Léoville Barton is very interesting as Lilian Barton Sartorius made a wine that almost merge completely positively with the vintage. Something that was surely not easy to do...

Nic

stefan · Post by **stefan** » Mon Nov 23, 2020 2:18 am

The most important thing is that this be an election with every vote counted, so that everyone can accept whichever wine wines. All BWEers should send their votes to Jim, who will accurately count and report the result. No recounts, no appeals; we all trust the BD to do a proper job.

JimHow · Post by **JimHow** » Mon Nov 23, 2020 2:23 am

Send samples as well... or, if you prefer, Dom Perignon.

Blanquito · Post by **Blanquito** » Mon Nov 23, 2020 2:54 am

I always knew Jim was in cahoots with Hugo Chavez.

jckba · Post by **jckba** » Mon Nov 23, 2020 3:32 am

I’ve previously stated and will continue to maintain that the WOTY should come from the current vintage being released onto the market which in this case means a 2017 because I think it champions the thought that there are Bdx wines worthy of buying in every vintage.

Chateau Vin · Post by **Chateau Vin** » Mon Nov 23, 2020 3:39 am

It seems 2014 vintage pleasantly surprised quite a number BWErs, and why not pick 2014 Leo Barton or 2014 Calon? Woulb be a tribute for the vintage, plus the vintage is among the recent, if not most recent. Just saying...

Blanquito · Post by **Blanquito** » Mon Nov 23, 2020 3:43 am

If a recent vintage is the primary criterion, the 2014 Leoville Barton would get my first, second and third votes.

JimHow · Post by **JimHow** » Mon Nov 23, 2020 3:44 am

We already picked the 2014 Calon Segur, CV:

BWE WINES OF THE YEAR

2000: 1996 Sociando-Mallet
2001: 1989 Lynch-Bages
2002: 1995 d'Yquem
2003: 1999 Haut Brion Blanc
2004: 2000 Pichon Baron and 2000 du Tertre
2005: 2000 Margaux
2006: 2003 Pontet-Canet
2007: 2002 Leoville Poyferre
2008: 2005 Burgundy vintage (protest vote)
2009: 1989 Lafite Rothschild
2010: 2005 Cantemerle
2011: 2008 Leoville Poyferre
2012: 2009 Giscours
2013: 2004 Smith Haut Lafitte
2014: 2010 Chasse Spleen
2015: 2012 Leoville Las Cases
2016: 2012 Barde-Haut
2017: 2014 Calon Segur
2018: 2015 Brane Cantenac
2019: 2016 Tour Saint Christophe

Chateau Vin · Post by **Chateau Vin** » Mon Nov 23, 2020 3:53 am

JimHow wrote:We already picked the 2014 Calon Segur, CV:

BWE WINES OF THE YEAR

2000: 1996 Sociando-Mallet
2001: 1989 Lynch-Bages
2002: 1995 d'Yquem
2003: 1999 Haut Brion Blanc
2004: 2000 Pichon Baron and 2000 du Tertre
2005: 2000 Margaux
2006: 2003 Pontet-Canet
2007: 2002 Leoville Poyferre
2008: 2005 Burgundy vintage (protest vote)
2009: 1989 Lafite Rothschild
2010: 2005 Cantemerle
2011: 2008 Leoville Poyferre
2012: 2009 Giscours
2013: 2004 Smith Haut Lafitte
2014: 2010 Chasse Spleen
2015: 2012 Leoville Las Cases
2016: 2012 Barde-Haut
2017: 2014 Calon Segur
2018: 2015 Brane Cantenac
2019: 2016 Tour Saint Christophe

Ok. My bad, BD. Then my vote goes to 2016 Gloria... they have been upping their game lately, nice qpr and it’s one of the recent vintages as well. And BTW, 16 Gloria is a dynamite IMO...

jckba · Post by **jckba** » Mon Nov 23, 2020 4:01 am

The more I think about it, the more I think that I would rather see us voting and championing a BWE estate of the year versus a WOTY, then maturity or vintage doesn’t really matter and it’s just whether or not you can get behind a particular estate.

marcs · Post by **marcs** » Mon Nov 23, 2020 4:50 am

Guys...Jim is just going to exercise his prerogative and pick the 2018 Tour St Christophe. 97 points Suckling, 95 points Jeb Dunnock, a big YUM YUM YUM from Jim Howaniec, $30 retail...game, set, and match

Musigny 151 · Post by **Musigny 151** » Mon Nov 23, 2020 5:23 am

My best wine was a complete surprise, and dwarfed every other bottle I drank. It was a Bruno Thierry Cote Rotie from 1969. For those who have tasted twenty five year old Chave made by Gerard in the eighties will know the kind of wine I am talking about. Light bodied but with an incredibly intense perfume of spiced fruit, harness leather and smoked meat. But this was even better, the finish longer, and a peacock tail of multifaceted and layered flavor that lasted for several minutes.

Honorable mention to a Vieux Chateau Certan 2014, Gruaud 1978, Philip Togni 1997, a Ridge Monte Bello 1991 and a half bottle of J J Prum Wehlener Sonnenuhr auslese 2007 gold kapsel

Racer Chris · Post by **Racer Chris** » Mon Nov 23, 2020 11:43 am

My personal woty so far is 1985 Chateau Margaux, but I wouldn't expect it to be the 2020 BWE nominee.
I have no recommendation on that.

Claudius2 · Post by **Claudius2** » Mon Nov 23, 2020 1:07 pm

Guys
Just my two cents.
I have always argued that a recent vintage should be picked and the wine should be reasonably available.
So I agreed with 96 Sociando Mallet and still do.
Did not agree with 89 Lafite for that reason.

Picking an estate sounds like a good idea to me and I think then it can be used to put some focus on estates that are over performing (QPR or just having reached a new level).

Cheers
Mark

OrlandoRobert · Post by **OrlandoRobert** » Mon Nov 23, 2020 1:37 pm

Ok outside observer here. Me thinks it should always be a recent Bordeaux vintage and a Chateau that got buzz from the group all year. In this case 2016 is clearly the vintage. Next year I’m sure it will be 2018. Jimbo has been posting like crazy on the 2016s, so much so that I ended up buying multiple cases even after I said at 54 I’m out of the new vintage game. Seeing Stefan as the Grand Wizard still buying helped, too. Personally I’d do Sociando since the MAN just retired. Yea, would be fitting to make his last vintage, 2019, the wine of the year, but of course we haven’t tasted it. The 2016 is strong!

Comte Flaneur · Post by **Comte Flaneur** » Mon Nov 23, 2020 4:48 pm

My most memorable clarets this year (outside Ch Margaux 1996) were Talbot 1966 and D’Issan 1985.

I think D’Issan deserves a special mention - at our vertical with Emmanuel Cruz the 2014 was excellent and the 2010 was outstanding.

If we want to go to the RB may I suggest VCC? I have not tried the 2014 yet but I bought some this year. The 1998 VCC is a stalwart which is now drinking wonderfully.

But my vote would go to any number of 21st century vintages from Leoville Barton - plus the 1989 and 1990 which are wonderful.

This is an estate which in the last few years has gone from a solid second to a super second at half the price of the other super seconds and a small fraction of the price of the FGs.

If I had to choose one however I think it would be the 2002, a wine which encompasses everything BWE stands for.

Or, if you want a younger wine perhaps the 2014?

It is a shame we collectively did not taste more 2017s this year. It really seems to be a Cinderella vintage.

Blanquito · Post by **Blanquito** » Mon Nov 23, 2020 5:06 pm

OrlandoRobert wrote:Ok outside observer here.

I checked and your 8 year anniversary on BWE is coming up in January!

In my estimation, that makes you an inner circle member at this point.

Come on in, the water is fine! (https://youtu.be/SBjWHBHlvAs)

jckba · Post by **jckba** » Mon Nov 23, 2020 5:26 pm

Comte Flaneur wrote: It is a shame we collectively did not taste more 2017s this year. It really seems to be a Cinderella vintage.

Agreed though I did slog through a large number of the wines at the UGC in January and to me, while 2017 did seem like a classically styled vintage where the quality was varied and there was an uneven ripening amongst the wines on show, my issue stemmed more from the release pricing which was too high coupled with new 25% tariffs on wines under 14% which basically stopped me dead in my tracks.

Comte Flaneur · Post by **Comte Flaneur** » Mon Nov 23, 2020 5:39 pm

Yes good points JC.

I only have 18 bottles of 2017s only RBs, Millery and Conseillante, the latter picked up in a sale. Leoville Barton seems reasonably priced at £280/6 ib but I could imagine scenarios where 2017 prices soften significantly

Musigny 151 · Post by **Musigny 151** » Mon Nov 23, 2020 6:37 pm

I will happily vote for the 2014 VCC.

marcs · Post by **marcs** » Thu Nov 26, 2020 7:06 am

If we let Mark choose the BWE WOTY, recent years would run like:

2016: 2014 VCC
2017: 2014 VCC
2018: 2014 VCC
2019: 2014 VCC
2020: 2014 VCC

Nicklasss · Post by **Nicklasss** » Thu Nov 26, 2020 6:05 pm

JimHow wrote:Yes but that is my point, shouldn’t the BWE wine of the year be more than a wine that a couple guys liked at one tasting in DC?

Come on Jim. This would be completely acceptable. And it would be more fair than for the 2015 or 2019 BWE WOTY, when only one person had tasted/liked the wine.

Also, the 2001, 2002, 2009 and 2015 BWE WOTY have been all selected from that criteria "a wine that a couple guys liked at one tasting"!

Nic

Nicklasss · Post by **Nicklasss** » Thu Nov 26, 2020 6:12 pm

marcs wrote:If we let Mark choose the BWE WOTY, recent years would run like:

2016: 2014 VCC
2017: 2014 VCC
2018: 2014 VCC
2019: 2014 VCC
2020: 2014 VCC

Personally, having taste a few 2013 in the 2015 BWE Bordeaux tour, i would no have any problem with 2014 VCC being the 2013 BWE WOTY.

Nic

JimHow · Post by **JimHow** » Sun Dec 06, 2020 2:49 pm

jckba · Post by **jckba** » Sun Dec 06, 2020 3:29 pm

If left bank and a redo of a wine from the 2016 vintage, I would be in favor of Lalande and/or Barton.

Comte Flaneur · Post by **Comte Flaneur** » Sun Dec 06, 2020 3:43 pm

2002 Leoville Barton

Blanquito · Post by **Blanquito** » Sun Dec 06, 2020 5:28 pm

Comte Flaneur wrote:2002 Leoville Barton

+1. This is the sort of wine that I probably would have never tried if not for BWE. This wine (and vintage) had basically zero buzz from the “pros”, who instead usually steered us towards bigger, louder stuff. And most of all, it is a seriously good wine, far better than I expected when I had it (even after all the BWE love).

Nicklasss · Post by **Nicklasss** » Wed Dec 09, 2020 10:22 pm

I know it is a shame we did not drink or commented any 2017. It is like an "unexisting vintage" on BWE, what i found a bit weird as i guess it is reviewed as a good vintage.

If we want to go that way, from what I have tasted at the 2017 UGC tasting, Talbot, Pichon Lalande, Léoville Barton, Langoa Barton and Phelan Segur made very solid wines.

Nic